Pistons-Suns Game Thread

Kevin I think you should point out that the Suns are giving up a ridiculous amount of offensive rebounds this year. Considering all the talent and athleticism Amare has, he is a very lazy defensive rebounder. NO had a field day on second change points.

If guys like Jerebko, Maxiell and Stuckey get a lot of offensive rebounds, then this a winnable game. The real question is who do you put on Amare? He might be a little too quick for Ben, however with the same token, he doesn’t look fully up to strength. If Charlie can keep up strength wise, then it might be a smarter matchup to put Ben on Fry, because Fry does a good job of finding open shots.

True Shooting Percentages

S. Nash .628
J. Richardson .624
S. Stoudemire .608
C. Frye .583
3. Barbosa .550

W. Bynum .581
B. Gordon .564
C. Villanueva .561
R. Stuckey .468

With Prince and Hamilton vacationing no one else on the Pistons shoots the ball

What happened to our depth? we lost our top 2 players. where would Orlando’s depth be without Vince Carter and Dwight Howard? or Boston without Paul Pierce and KG? It’s foolish to say we aren’t a deep team just because we lose by 3 in overtime on the road against the team with the best homecourt advantage in the league, without our top two players.

TRADE TRUE SHOOTING PERCENTAGE NOW

Already, the Phoenix announcers have said:
1) Stuckey isn’t a “quick” guard and will not be able to keep up with Steve Nash.
2) The Pistons missed the playoffs last season, for the first time since 2001.

Wait, really?

alrighty, any good feeds for this game?

wow, pheonix opens up 5 for 5. yikes

Amare lookin’ like James worthy.

Didn’t Stuck have lock-down performances against Nash last year?

www.adthe.net

atdhe.net, you mean

Sounds like we have fans in Phoenix.

BEAUTIFUL RUN!

yeah, sorry bout that! www.atdhe.net

Stuckey has as many assists as attempts at 3 each, Villanueva with 60% shooting.

Way to stay in the game Pistons.

Anyone else think this team is better than it’s record? I’d say that the Pistons are more of a .500 team than a 5-8 team. Maybe even a little better with Rip back.

I like when Max gets to come in as a single substitution and plays with the starters.

Wrong Dajuan sighting

I can live with that CV31 miss as long as he keeps taking it to the rim like that. Good stuff.

Future Piston Amare Stoudamire?

Beautiful D to hold that out, Summers forced Stoudamire into a bad position who passed it to Dudley, then got it blocked by Jerebko.

Nice block JJ ! Nice O-board and putback from Max.

Good picture on the atdhe link tonite.

I’m in Hong Kong waiting for my flight to Toronto. Go Stones! I will keep up to date with this Airports crappy wireless.

Will seems to be pressing to get assists. He needs to go to the hole.

What is with Wilcox playing and Kwame getting the bench treatment?

Why is Wilcox in the game? Are we throwing in the towel on this game already?

That’s twice that Wilcox has tapped an offensive rebound out to—- the Suns.

Summers for the 3!

Summers!

TWD showin’ us somethin!

he had a good outing last night as well. here’s to hoping he gets more playing time.

The announcers just described the Pistons as a trampoline. Nice. :D

Also, I wish we could have lured Grant Hill back a few years ago. Looks like he found the fountain of youth out there.

Wilcox fumbles a pass. He is not good at the game of basketball.

Wilcox was picked before Amare!!! Wow that’s great.

Bynum… 6 minutes, 1 shot, (+/-) -11.

TWD!!! for threeee!

Summers is not bashful.

Summers Again! although as wish we wouldn’t play there brand of basketball

The Wrong Dajuan with The Right Stoke.

Cripes. Are the Suns going to shoot like this the whole game?
Here’s hoping not.

Our high pick and roll D makes baby Jesus cry.

Down by ten with only one turnover… and the Suns keep making baskets. 62% shooting for them. We need to poke some eyes.

Dan Majerle looks like he could still drop some bombs from deep.

*stroke

Bynum back to shooting. Pistons close the gap…. then another swish-3 by Suns…ah well..

Some scrambling defense and active hands from this lineup.

Chucky sighting!

Atkins and Wilcox = night of tragic

I read that both Prince and Rip were participating in light practice… anyone heard a time table for either player?

we need more of JJ…

we need more cowbell

We need more points than the other team.

is stuckey playing as poorly as his box score indicates? is he the one guarding nash?

“most of the time when we hold the other team to less than 100 points and we score more than 100 point we win”

Lions had some cowbell today.

the team cracks tonite on under the pressure of the back to back roadtrip from hell.

Man, Amare doesn’t look like he has nearly as much lift as he used to. Still enough to dunk all over our faces, but he used to really get up.

Stuckey has been mostly invisible.

Pistons are setting up for another almost amazing- almost comeback- for the almost win.

Wow. Rough half. Terrible offense AND defense. I can’t wait for Rip (and hopefully Tay) to come back because we have zero chemistry. It’s just a bunch of guys who happen to have blue jerseys on.

A bunch of color blind guys who happen to have blue jerseys on.

We need more SpineDok

@Ra: Maybe that’s what Tay needs?

I hate to say it but I don’t think Prince is ever going to be 100% again. He’s been out for a month with a bad back. NBA players(or people in general) with bad backs don’t get better.

Did you guy’s see KG’s buzzer beater against New York? What kind of screen involves putting both of your hands into the defender’s hips and pushing him out of the way?

Jesus cured blindness and leprosy, but I don’t remember reading about any bad backs being cured.

Sheed was 0for6 this afternoon.
Boston is souring on him already.

the release on cv’s shot was the same that stuckey uses for his drives.

Herrmann-esque finger roll by JJ! Nice!

the suns are good. the pistons played their butts off and lost in overtime late last night. the jazz are good. the blazers are good. the lakers are the champs. the mavs are good. i don’t see too many teams doing that great with this schedule. i really didn’t expect to get one win out of this. but the headline is slumping pistons…we will see how they recover.

Props to Blaha for the shout out to Wayne State school of medicine! haha

Poor Jerebko is out there playing 1 on 5.

It sure looks that way doesn’t. I would like to see how our “big” rotation will fare. It has been successful when used sparingly

*doesn’t it?

No Kwame and no Daye? Doesn’t look good for a big rotation.

Hmp. I’m in Albuquerque and get Fox Sports Arizona, and for some reason they just stopped showing the game to cut to some weird shit about Sports Sciences. Lame.

The atdhe feed recently died too.

Also, the espn play-by-play wont update… Maybe Q forfeited.

It updated… we’re still losing.

If Wilcox has any kids.. Amare just ate all of them.

Wilcox really is just terrible. How did he put up decent numbers for the Sonics? 13 and 7 in 2006/2007!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xe3yV2rgrus this should cheer yall up

Re: Garnett’s play

That fuckin’ prick mag dogs the camera after cheating to beat the KNICKS. He lost any class once he went to the Celts.

Garnett didn’t have class when he played on the Wolves, either:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7pTiEkfQ6pk

Grant Hill: Things might have been different had we not let Allan Houston go to free agency.

Me: (checking Grant Hill’s fingers for rings) Hard to disagree.

No doubt, Hill said one of the reasons he didn’t return later was that he felt like fans’ expectations would be too great.

We’d love to have that dude back now though.

I guess there are some positives to take from this game.

+At least Jonas Jerebko plays like he cares
+We didn’t get beat by 50
+Summers can hit a few shots
+Chucky Atkins playing means that Bynum’s ankle gets rest and Stuckey can ice his hand in preparation to shoot Lindsey Hunter% for the season
+Chris Wilcox might be the inverse-Darko (The Human Loss Cigar)

Zachatollah: Steve Nash’s vitamin water commercial is also a positive to take from this game:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxZkaEge0R8

+Maybe the Davidson family can collect royalties from the Lou Amundson highlight video we’re producing.

I think the refs just want this game to end now.

+Chucky Atkins’ mom gets to hear George Blaha say nice things about her boy.

Just got back from work, looked at the score, and scoffed.

Found this quote in one of the links above, stated by Portland coach Nate McMillan:
“I want to give the team back to Brandon. It’s his team.”

He’s benching Andre Miller to do so. Why the fuck did you sign Andre in the first place?

Man, ugly game all around. Looks like we’re ready for some time off and some rest.

Sweet…Stuckey shoots 4/15. Even worse, I expected it. God damn combo guards.

Someone should show Rodney a picture of Larry Hughes every time he shoots like this. Maybe it will convince him to pass the ball on occasion.

it’s like we’ve all been saying from the beginning, this team lives and dies by the backcourt. tonight, the stuck and el commish combined for 7 of 26. yikes

Sam Mitchell is doing some nice commentary in the post-game show. He was always a great interview in Toronto.

Sam Mitchell should be back in the league pretty soon, I’m surprised he’s not right now.

Some SLAM love for Bynumite:

http://www.slamonline.com/online/blogs/flintstone-tv-blogs/2009/11/will-bynum-rodney-stuckey/

Summers: 13 points on 5 for 11 fga’s.

Also, in 23 minutes of playing time: 0 rebounds, 0 assists, 1 steal, 0 blocks. yuck.

coupla’ more games and Summers will turn into the right Dejaun.

My biggest question the past couple of days is, what’s up with Kwame being nailed to the bench?

I was thinking of posting before the game even got started that this had all the indications of a blowout Piston loss: still missing two starters; end of a tough road trip; second of a back to back when the previous game went into OT; all previous games requiring (and, generally, getting) tremendous effort just to stay in it; and playing one of the best teams in the league, one that plays at an up-temp pace at that.

Mama told me there would be days like these. In the not too distant future, the schedule gets a bit easier and presumably we get at least Rip back. Losing streaks stink, and too much more of this and it will bite us in the playoff chase. But the team can take some encouraging things out of the first three games of the trip, albeit no Ws.

@ Gabe:

Also, in 23 minutes of playing time: 0 rebounds, 0 assists, 1 steal, 0 blocks. yuck.

Exactly. We’re bound to here that Summers played well last night, but only because he had 13 points, which he scored at a relatively low efficiency while doing literally nothing else. But at least he scored 13 points.

And Rodney Stuckey … well, I guess I’m a broken record at this point. Will someone please teach that kid what a good shot is?

On the upside, I love Jonas, Ben Wallace, and Maxiel (if he could foul a little less).

======

To the future:

Our next five games are against -

Cleveland
LA Clips
Atlanta
Chicago
Milwaukee

It doesn’t get much easier for the next week or so. Of those teams, five are currently playoff teams (yeah, it’s early, but still). Getting Rip and Tay is going to help us, sure, but meanwhile, it could get really ugly for us really quick.

I fear that if we don’t win three of those five games, we’re going to be in a hole that’s gonna be touch to climb out of. If we win three of those, we climb up to 8-11, get our guys back, play a little better than .500 ball for the rest of the year and fight for a playoff spot. But we could just as easily lost four of those five, IMO, which would put us at 6-13.

In other words, this next week and a half is critical to our playoff aspirations.

Holy spelling fail batman.

Also, I meant to quote TJ:

In the not too distant future, the schedule gets a bit easier and presumably we get at least Rip back.

I’ll be thrilled when Rip gets back … but looking at our schedule, yes, it gets a little easier, meaning that we don’t have an immediate four-game road trip against playoff teams, but our upcoming opponents are all very solid. At the very least, over the next five games, we’re not playing anyone who’s clearly inferior to us.

Man, I’m in Keith Langlois mood today … bad grammar, run-ons, and commas galore.

All three rookies need to get major minutes. Summers need to be our starting 3, Jerebko need to come off the bench at the 4 and give us that offence and deffensive energy we need when Chalie V goes out. Daye need to back up Summers at the 3 and play a little 2.

We need to stop putting our faith in proven loosers like Kwame, Wilcox, and now Maxell. The only time these guys play when their pt threaten, so it’s time to threaten their play time.

We need to open up our offence with these rookies. other rookies on other teams are having a impact season. why we’re giving ours limited pt like we have a better solution. (5-9) is not a better solution.

Rip and Tay is out, so Coach Q need to treat this team like Rip and Tay is out and give all the Rookies shot at turning our season around before it’s too late.

Summers as the starting 3 and Jerebko as backup 4?

Backwards, joe, sorry.

The way we used Summers in the summer league is the way we should use him now. This will relieve some of the offensive presure off of Gordan so he can become more of a offensive threat. Right now our offence is too predictable.

Summer league doesn’t equal NBA regular season.

Sure, Summers scored some points last night — but Jonas has been playing quality ball in big minutes since Tay’s injury! Benching him and then playing him out of position (at the 4) makes sense how?

Brgulker:

Well, easier. The Hawks and Cavs are elite teams, but if we can’t play with the Bulls, Bucks, and Clippers, then we really aren’t a playoff team.

More broadly, though I’ve been making your point that if we keep losing most of our games in the next couple of weeks, we will be digging ourselves a problematically big hole in the playoff chase. Especially since it doesn’t like like a .440 team is going to make the playoffs from the East this year.

Yeah, it doesn’t make sense to start Summers. I do think his play merits a little longer look, though. I would like to see him get a couple rebounds in 23 mins of play, but he did some good things – made a few shots, played some good D on Amare at one point. He looked pretty terrible when he tried to put the ball on the floor, but I don’t think it would be hard to find 15 mins at the 3 and 4 for him. Maybe if he plays more at the three, we’d see less of the three guard line up.

I’m not going to fret the losses much this season. Hell, the more we lose, the more likely Joe will be to make a trade. If Joe feels pressure to right the ship, I trust he’ll do so.

(although, the injuries to Tay and Rip may be an excuse cushion for him. i certainly hope not)

Alright, time to stir the Hornet’s nest:

Earlier this summer, I linked to an article by Dave Berri that predicted the following:

If the players on the Pistons’ roster produced at the same rate as they had throughout their careers, the Pistons would win 28 games. I was shocked by that prediction, but Berri’s had a knack for being a pretty reliable predictor of team wins, if nothing else. Others from DBB were shocked as well, as any Pistons fan would be.

Most of us were hoping for a winning season, figuring that if everyone stayed healthy, we’d hover a few over/under .500 games.

Right now — with the injuries — we are 5/9, for a .357 winning percentage. Simple math tells us that if we continue to win/lose at that pace, we will win 29.274 games.

Obviously, the injury bug has hit, and it’s hit us hard. But the question I’m asking myself right now is — does the return of Rip and/or Tay improve us enough to make us a .500 team from here on out? They are quality players, but are 15 percentage points good?

As a qualifier, let’s remember that Rip and Tay’s minutes will have to come from somewhere. Jerebko has produced at the 3, and MFWB has been MFWB. Those two guys seem the most likely to have their minutes decline upon the return of Rip/Tay (along with Summers/Daye). In other words, two productive players will likely see their minutes go down when two other productive players return.

What does DBB think?

I like JJ, but I’m not sure where this “he’s been productive” trope is coming from…

i think five games in a row against the leagues best on no rest mostly away is with veteran core injured is not a good basis for extrapolation. the team has upsides. not having to go to los angeles pheonix portland utah for the rest of the year is one concrete upside.

@brgulker – yes. The Pistons are at least a .500 club with a healthy Rip and Tay. They solve some of the serious scoring distribution issues we are having, and they both know how to play solid defense.

This particular game was a tired team getting hammered by a piss-off team that just laid an egg. I should have bet my house on the spread (whatever it was). No reason to get upset about this particular game.

I just hope the Pistons can put up a fight against the Cavs on Wed. Damn, I hate that team.

bring on the least of the east.

I see DaJuan’s breakout has been glossed over because he wasn’t the “chic” pick at his position..

13 points and solid D is exactly what Tay gives the team, and it’s ok for him but DaJuan has to play above and beyond that in order to warrant even a sniff of reaction from the rather uppity group here.

@brgulker

No offense, I know we’re trying to like patch things up and all but… Dave Berri can still get bent. You can look at the names on virtually any roster in the NBA and without working up some calculus equation, and provide a guess within 5 wins of how good the team will be.

With the high turnover rate (players not actual turnovers) for our team, it’s easy to say “well this team is destined to 28-40 wins”. Dave Berri didn’t have a math equation to show the improvement of Bynum, and he won’t ever have an equation that can accurately translate how a rookie or bench performer will do because he can not adjust the numbers to allow for more or less minutes accordingly. He can adjust “usage rates” with the per minute average and come up with a roundabout figure.

I like JJ, but I’m not sure where this "he’s been productive" trope is coming from…

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/j/jerebjo01.html

His numbers aren’t great just yet, but on top of the rebounds and blocks, he hustles, scraps, and plays solid D. IMO, he’s locked up a job as our backup SF.

What I was trying to get at was that in Tay’s absence, our production has dropped, but it hasn’t disappeared … I didn’t say that well, though.

With Rip, it’s not that clear that he’s head and shoulders better than any of the guys whose minutes he’ll be taking … am I wrong about that?

@ Boney:

Dave Berri can still get bent.

Even Berri admits that his metric isn’t a replacement for observation and analysis of that observation. For me, it’s just one piece of what I use as an interested fan. In the past, his predictions have been scarily accurate. And of course, his prediction is predicated on the following: if players perform as they have performed in the past… We’ve all agreed that there’s lots of room for improvement with with some of our guys, Stuckey and CV in particular. Berri also didn’t figure on Ben Wallace 1) playing this well and 2) playing this much.

But I get your point.

Before Tayshaun comes back, I would like to see Dajuan Summers get the start over Jonas Jerebko. I like Jerebko’s hustle and energy, but agree with Rob G when he says, I like JJ, but I’m not sure where this "he’s been productive" trope is coming from…

Jerebko has been a bright spot on this team in terms of hustle, energy and dedication. However, his only offense appears to be cleanup work, he’s not a good shooter and his defense has only been solid when he’s guarding smaller players (specifically 2 guards). That skill set isn’t prototypical of a wing player. Without a mid-range our outside game, our team is going to have even more scoring problems than our frontcourt weaknesses present.

I’d like to see Summers get a few starts before Tayshaun gets back. While he’s only had limited minutes so far, he’s shown some comfort on both ends of the floor. He appears to be a clear offensive upgrade over Jerebko— he has confidence from range (jonas does not) and is converting at 50% outside the paint and to the perimeter. His D has been impressive, especially last night against Stoudamire. Summers has the body to make big 3’s work on the offensive end, and the outside stroke to stretch things out for our driving guards (again, something Jerebko does not provide).

I don’t for a second think the first 274 minutes of Jerebko’s career are indicative of his long term potential. I am not saying Jerebko is a bad player. But before Prince comes back, I believe that Summers’ performance in limited minutes should give him a crack at the starting lineup for a few games, if only to see what we really have on our hands. If we go back to Jerebko or play Jerebko behind Prince upon his return, fine. But if the minutes were matched, Summers is clearly a better offensive option, and he may be better suited to guard big 3s than Jerebko is, especially since Jerebko hasn’t guarded 3s well so far this season.

Re: Rip coming back

Back to backs were not supposed to be a major weakness for this team, with its youth and athleticism. But look what happens when Rip is gone and three players divide up ALL of the backcourt minutes two nights in a row. Stuckey and Gordon shoot terribly. When that happens, with Rip and Tay out, this team has no chance. None.

Also, we have seen how this team, without Rip and Tay, can only win when 3 out of the 4 of CV31, Bynum, Stuckey, and Gordon are having good nights. That’s just to give them a chance. Throw in Rip and Tay and the wiggle room is much greater. Plus, those guys being in makes it more likely that all of the aforementioned players will have good games.

I will be very interested to see how each of the rookies defend LeBron Wednesday night. Because, really, who else is going to?

@ brgulker, The key tangible that Rip and Tay bring that has been sorely missed is rest. As far as our three gaurds I dont think that a reduction in minutes will hurt there #s in anyway, as they already have established games. Since the injuries we have seen some horrific effeciency #s from all three gaurds.

I am sure we can all blame that on fatigue. Especially when all of our games have been back to backs. we are a 28 win team with out Tay/Rip. But it is no stretch to say we are easily a .500 team with them. with the exception of Phoenix we “could” have won every game.

With that said, Tay’s return “may” Hurt JJ as he is still trying to figure out his role and only time on the court wil take him to that next level.

@ Boney
To hell with anyone that thinks Dejaun needs to play above and beyond" Tay. last I checked, Blair avgd. 5 and 5 per 18.
That should be the measuring stick. and while 13 points don’t mean a thing during a blowout. It does prove that he has the confidence to score unlike wont’cox. and he has been solid on defense. I know, some want to see him fail so that they can say they were right. It’s not gonna happen.

Brgulker: To agree/sum up some of the other points. . . .

Detroit is down two starters — guys with lots of winning experience. Rip was our best offensive player last year, and Tay, when he’s right, is solid on both ends. JJ is doing fine for a rookie, but he’s nowhere near a full-strength Tay, especialy on offense, and that’s a huge issue when our team has exactly ONE other front court player with real offensive skills (CV).

As others have mentioned, Rip could keep the other three guards from playing excessive minutes (say, on a back-to-back at the end of a road trip when the previous night’s game went into OT). Or could sub in when one guard clearly didn’t have it on some night for whatever reason (see some recent performances from Stuckey and Gordon).

Now, maybe even with Rip and Tay, we have a losing record on the road trip. Those were quality teams, on the road, and we still have an unbalanced roster with not enough front court scoring. But I think overall we’re a .500 team, certainly way better than 28 wins.

Of course, if Rip and Tay take too long to come back, we may be looking at a truly bad record. But worst-case scenario, the rooks will get more experience, and we’ll get a decent draft choice.

@scntfc:
I know, some want to see him fail so that they can say they were right. It’s not gonna happen.

That’s a tremendous stretch, I don’t think anyone wants that. Just because some of us, myself included, wished we had selected Blair instead, doesn’t mean we don’t want Summers to succeed. If anything, we’d love to be proven wrong.

I want Summers to start. I also wanted us to pick Blair. Suggesting there is anyone here who wants Summers to fail so that we can be right about that pick— is retarded.

Also, I agree with pretty much everything Toledo Joe said.

to expect a rook to perform above and beyond Tayshaun Prince when the guy that he is selected over is just putting up 5 and 5, is a bit more retarded wouldn’t you think?

@scntfc:
to expect a rook to perform above and beyond Tayshaun Prince

Who said that?

when the guy that he is selected over is just putting up 5 and 5

That’s actually pretty incredible when you’re behind Tim Duncan and Antonio McDyess in the depth chart. Per minute, that’s better than any player wearing a Pistons jersey this season.

Not sure what you’re saying, but yeah, what you said was more retarded.

“13 points and solid D is exactly what Tay gives the team, and it’s ok for him but DaJuan has to play above and beyond that in order to warrant even a sniff of reaction from the rather uppity group here.”

Here is a Quote from the person who I addressed. If you had taken the time to read it. then you would know why I said what I said.

The fact that he gets 5 and 5 on the same team as Dice and Duncan is of little relevance being that their individual #s have not changed much per minutes played. It is of even more irrelevance being that their record is no better than ours.

So let me rephrase the question so that you may understand it better. Do you expect Summers to play above and beyond Tay in order for him to not be considered a bust? If so, that is an unrealistic expectation. and It is safe to say that you would much rather see him fail…

@scntfc:
So let me rephrase the question so that you may understand it better. Do you expect Summers to play above and beyond Tay in order for him to not be considered a bust? If so, that is an unrealistic expectation. and It is safe to say that you would much rather see him fail…

Arright, Stretchy McStretcherpants. Relax a little bit, that’s one hell of an ambitious stretch you’re trying to make there.

I expect Summers to be a serviceable backup. At best, a role player starter. At worst, a bust. In my opinion, a second round player can’t be a bust unless there were other, better opportunities available at that player’s pick. Example: Walter Sharpe vs. DeAndre Jordan.

Do you expect Summers to play above and beyond Tay

I don’t have any expectations for Summers. The only rookie I have expectations for are Austin Daye, who is failing my expectations thus far. But can Summers play above and beyond Tay?

That’s setting the bar pretty low. I’m quite confident that if you gave Dajuan Summers Tayshaun Prince’s minutes from the last, I don’t know, three playoff ending series, he’d fare a hell of a lot better on offense, and may not have posed a significant loss on defense. I was quite vocal about Tayshaun early this summer, as he’s been the weakest link on our team whenever we lose a playoff series. His offensive almost literally disappears.

Just so you can understand the pro-Blair pick side of the argument: those of us who would have preferred a Blair pick are NOT ANGRY WITH DAJUAN SUMMERS. We’re angry with Joe Dumars. Summers has my support, I want the best of him, and I would be thrilled to be proven wrong about my preference for Blair. As long as Summers is not a complete waste, I’m going to support dude and cheer him on. Ya know, like I and others did up and down this thread above.

All that said, you can still get the f#ck out of here with that “I’d rather see DaJuan Summers fail” nonsense. There’s not a commenter here that wants that.

You can deflect, turn the argument around all you want, scntfc, but to suggest that any commenter here wants a Piston player to fail isn’t just foolish, its f#cking sacrilegious.

/the canswer being the only exception to the above rule.

Arright, Stretchy McStretcherpants. Relax a little bit, that’s one hell of an ambitious stretch you’re trying to make there.

You should heed your on advice. The issue at hand didn’t require a titangraph.

here is what Boney said:
DaJuan has to play above and beyond that in order to warrant even a sniff of reaction from the rather uppity group here."

here is what I said:
To hell with anyone that thinks Dejaun needs to play above and beyond" Tay. last I checked, Blair avgd. 5 and 5 per 18.
That should be the measuring stick. and while 13 points don’t mean a thing during a blowout. It does prove that he has the confidence to score unlike wont’cox. and he has been solid on defense. I know, some want to see him fail so that they can say they were right. It’s not gonna happen.

 I thought it was impossible for a Piston fan to be uppity. but if you are one of those who has managed to do so. then what I said was intended for you.

Otherwise I’m not going to go in circles with you. We all wanted the best player with that Pick. that has yet to be determined. we as fans know what unrealistic expectations can create. In the context of which I quoted Boney I was spot on. If it’s a soft spot for you. re read the “posts” and get a better understanding. if it still hurts,Then toughen up!

I think Jerebko has played more harder than Max, Coxs and Brown. That why I think he should back up Charlie V. As for starting at the 3, teams don’t guard him or Wallace on the offence end, it’s like 5 on 3. That’s why I won’t Summers to get the start.

Never realized this, but Carl Landry is un-restricted in 2011. I thought he had a longer contract, at least with a team option, but he’s wide open the summer after next. Carl and his PER of 23, 15/6/1 in 24 minutes (22/8 per 36) so far this season is a bit undersized to play the 5, but could be the Antonio McDyess 2.0 to the 6’11" Charlie V at the 4.

Competition will be tough for dude if he continues to improve, but we’re due to have some pretty money available and in need of another scoring big ASAP. I know I’m not the first to mention this option, but I sure as shit love it.

@scntfc:
Toughen up? Are you suggesting that I’m, ya know, “scntfc”? :)

Otherwise I’m not going to go in circles with you.

Well, that’s all you’re really doing, and it’s kind of boring. You’re dodging your own fuckup in suggesting there are people here who want a Piston to fail. You’re beating a dead horse I’m not riding, specifically a comparison between Summers and Blair. Didn’t I make my expectations of dude clear enough?

re: “soft spots”, “still hurt”, I’m totally lost. Might want to get away from the computer for a bit, you’re either confused or projecting. For now, I’m gonna go ahead and ignore you, all this nonsense is likely hurting the other readers eyes.

I think Summers has the potential to be better than Jerebko, but he needs minutes to meet that potential. He’s not bashful and can fill it up, and he has an NBA-ready body that makes Jerebko and Daye look like boys. I think it’s easy to fall in love with Jerebko’s effort and hustle because it’s been a while since we’ve had someone go full-out and play with that annoying, pesky, frenetic style. If Summers can get minutes, though, I think he can be the more effective long-term guy. I see Jerebko more as a Birdman-style spark plug* in limited minutes or specific situations.

*I’ve said before that I thought Wilcox had the potential to be our Birdman, but he SUCKS. Like, big time.

Mike Payne, If Summers has to play above and beyond Tayshaun, for anyone to “give a sniff of a reaction” in the words of boney. Then that absolutely proves me right.

Sorry you took offense buddy. It was’nt directed at you as you already said that you would love to be proven wrong in that regard.

As far as soft spots. whether the shoe fit or not, you put it on. Why aknowledge it if it doesn’t apply to you.

I think we’ll have Rip back long before Tay,which should give Qster plenty of time to experiment at the 3.I’d love to see Summers get a few starts in really the only knock I can see on the guy is he needs to improve his rebounding, which I think he will.On a side note somebody mentioned they thought there was a possibility Tay might not make it back ,hopefully not the case,but if this happens what happens to his contract ,how do they resolve an issue like that?

@scntfc:
If Summers has to play above and beyond Tayshaun, for anyone to "give a sniff of a reaction" in the words of boney. Then that absolutely proves me right.

Both you and Boney are wrong. Summers doesn’t have to play above and beyond Tayshaun to “give a sniff of a reaction”. Read the fucking thread above, son. There’s plenty of praise for Summers in this thread alone.

Master of denial, you are. There’s no one here that wants Summers to fail. It’s retarded to suggest that there are people here that want that. In the wise words of Wallace, “get that shit outta here”.

Random little Langlois related thing (from his latest mailbag):

“The Pistons played at Phoenix last night, where the Suns remind me of the Pistons of the past few years. Even though the Suns are winning a lot of games, the overwhelming sense about that team is that they aren’t going to be a serious contender once the postseason rolls around. As difficult as the decision would have been, you can argue that the Suns should have made the move the Pistons made– trade their aging, veteran point guard, Steve Nash, to try to use him as the tool for rebuilding with a younger team.”

Keith’s logic immediately made me think: Phoenix winning a championship would be incredibly healthy for the NBA.

It’s still pretty crazy to me that in the minds of NBA “insiders” (and sometimes even GM’s), it makes sense to break up a great, popular team, and roll the dice on a rebuilding effort. That occasional practice, even if an argument can be made for its logic in particular cases, strikes me as something that really turns off casual fans.

IMO, what Phoenix and Dallas and San Antonio are all trying to do should be the blueprint for how you ride an elite core group of players through the later stages of their careers.

I caught the FanHouse article about how disgruntled Washington is so I was looking up contracts on the trade machine. Haywood was talking about checking egos at the door. Personally, I love Brendan Haywood and he’s only on the books for like 6 mil or something silly like that. I think he would be just what the doctor ordered up front. Maxiell and some change would be square on the books, but is Washington high on him or is Jamison more of a priority? Also he’s a free agent at years end, which makes sense for Washington to hold onto him. But what happens if he requests a trade? Anyone else think Haywood would make our team wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy better?

@Defor

Prince’s contract, like that of most NBA players, is fully guaranteed. So, even if Tay never plays another minute, the Pistons are still on the hook for all of it.

Also, I agree that Summers needs to improve his rebounding. That was a knock on him when he was drafted. I’m not so sure he will, though. How many players really do get better on the boards? Anyone know?

Finally! he gets some love after getting playing time. Probably the first thread that it’s ever happened in.

If I “yes dear you” and dont mention your panties being in a bunch, will you actually ignore me? Or is it mandatory that you have the last word.

joe dip: Brendan Haywood is tearing it up on my fantasy team. I’d take him if he keeps producing double doubles and lots of blocks.

Interesting news from Langlois:
“And while there is at least some encouraging news on Prince and Hamilton – both reported progress on Saturday and there’s some indication Prince could be back in another week or so, Hamilton perhaps shortly thereafter – they won’t be back in time to help this week.”

I’m starting to question Rip’s motivation. How does someone with a ruptured disk in their back recover faster than a sprained ankle? I thought Tay would be out for months, not just a few weeks. Either that says something about how tough Tay is, or Rip’s lack of toughness. Not to mention Bynum is playing on not one, but two bad ankles.

@bmr, re: rip

Ankle Sprains are difficult to judge…especially high ankle sprains. Some are very small, and can be like rolling an ankle, which would take a few days to recover. Others are worse than breaking a bone, which could take up to a month. Because Rip ended up going back into the game, I would say his was closer to the former, it’s still gotta hurt, and i’ll give him the benefit of the doubt.

@ bmr007:

I’m starting to question Rip’s motivation. How does someone with a ruptured disk in their back recover faster than a sprained ankle?

Have you ever had a high ankle sprain? Ask any Dr. around — a serious high ankle sprain can actually take longer to recover from than a broken bone. I know; I’ve had one while playing in college. They are nasty, lingering issues, and as a SG you’ve got to have your ankles and knees right if you’re going to be effective. Otherwise, every cut, every screen you come off of, and every jump(shot) causes pretty intense pain.

=======

Back to the question I posed yesterday; I agree with a lot of what’s been posted above. I do think Rip and Tay will make an impact. I’m rather skeptical that they make us 13 games better than we are (from a 29-win team to a 41-win team), but only time will tell in that regard.

The bigger concern I have is how deep a hole we are going to fall into until they are both fully healthy and ready to contribute. Looking at the schedule, it is entirely possible that this team could be something like 6-15 before we know it … and we really need to be a .500ish team to make the Playoffs this year. If Rap and Tay do make us a .500ish team, and that’s our ceiling, then it’s going to be mighty difficult to dig our way out of a 9-games-below-.500 hole.

=======

Regarding the wider conversation about JJ: I love that Q-ster is starting JJ and Ben Wallace, not so much for their immediate impact and productivity (JJ’s numbers aren’t great, Big Ben is still a beast) but rather because of what starting them says with respect to Q-ster’s tenure here. IMO, by starting Wallace and JJ, Q is establishing that under his watch, this is how you have to play if you want to play as a Piston. There’s no question in my mind that playing the way that JJ and Big Ben play is what won our chip in 04 and got us back to the Finals the following years — it’s just that we had more talented players playing that way than we currently do now.
 
I also love this about JJ — each and everytime he leaves the game, he looks absolutely gassed. Not because he’s out of shape, but because he’s played balls out for however long he’s been in the game. When is the last time we saw a Piston play that hard?

Regarding Summers: I’m not high on the kid, but I will gladly eat my own words if I’m wrong about him. I certainly don’t want him to fail, in the same way that I didn’t want Amir or Darko to fail. But as has been stated here multiple times, DaJuan has yet to demonstrate at any point in his collegiate or professional career that he is a competent rebounder or a consistently efficient scorer.

I love the kid’s attitude. By all counts he has a good work ethic. But in my view, he has literally done nothing to establish that he deserves a starting job. Seriously — a starting job? By all means, let’s use Tay’s injury as a chance to evaluate Summers, Daye, and Jerebko. Let’s figure out when and how they could be used both now and in the future. But start Summers? That’s asinine.

Call me a skeptic, call me a hater, whatever. I don’t want the kid to fail. But, I’m also not going to be naive. The overwhelming majority of kids who are 2nd round picks and are below-average shooters and below-average rebounders don’t stick in the NBA (and for good reason). I don’t want that to happen to any of our rooks, but I’m not going to stick my head in the sand and pretend it doesn’t happen each and every year in the NBA.

I also love this about JJ — each and everytime he leaves the game, he looks absolutely gassed. Not because he’s out of shape, but because he’s played balls out for however long he’s been in the game. When is the last time we saw a Piston play that hard?

Correct me if I’m wrong, but didn’t someone say that with exactly the same words somewhere on this site? I don’t remember which thread it was, but I definitely remember the word “gassed” and the phrases “not because he’s out of shape” and “balls out”. Did you copy and paste this from one of your previous threads br?

from one of your previous posts I meant

@Drew:
http://www.detroitbadboys.com/archives/2009-11-04/pistons-magic-recap/#comment-201135

I’m with BR on Tay and Rip not adding significantly to the W/L column, at least not necessarily pushing us above .500 with their added contributions alone. I’m also with BR on Summers, but in spite of the lack of a productive track record, I’m pumped to see what he’s got (not saying you’re not, BR).

As for “how deep of a hole” we’re headed toward, our schedule doesn’t really clear up until January. Yeah, that means we’ve got another month of a brutal schedule ahead of us. We’ll steal a few and win a few that we should, but if we’re going to climb out above .500 it’s probably not going to happen at the end of January or even into March (if at all). I’m just hoping that the injuries at present and the light schedule in January (and resulting uptick in w/l) don’t make Joe complacent and not pull the trigger on a trade.

And to reiterate my issue with Jerebko, I love his work ethic, hustle, dedication and energy— but his playing time just isn’t productive. We need scoring at every position we can get outside of the guard spots, and if Ben Wallace is on the court we absolutely need our SF to score, something Jerebko just doesn’t do (yet). Dude is shooting 23% on jumpers. 23%.

Ya know who Jerebko reminds me of? He’s not a good shooter. He’s not known to be entirely athletic. He’s in the game because of his heart, his hustle, his hard work. Sound familiar?

Michael Curry.

(that aside, I love jerebko, I know he has plenty of potential, I’m only commenting on his production thus far)

Oh. I guess I added balls to that memory all on my own.

Does that mean JJIAFI?

LOL @ myself and Drew for catching that :) I really am a broken record.

@ MP:

, I’m pumped to see what he’s got (not saying you’re not, BR).

This is the first season in recent memory where our rookies are actually going to get a chance to play. To me, getting a chance to see what our rooks and other young players have is probably going to be one of the most exciting parts of the season!

Concerning JJ’s shooting — that will come with time. You can already see him gaining confidence, game by game. He’ll improve that part of his game.

I hear your point about needing scoring from every position. When Tay comes back, there’s no question about who should be starting. But right now? What’s the alternative? Not to be overly pessimistic, but it’s not as if it’s obvious that Summers is actually a better scorer (and will be consistently) or if he just had a good shooting night. I’m not ready to start a guy just because he had a hot hand one night. Personally, I’d rather start a guy who rebounds, scraps, and plays hard.

One last point on productivity. Here’s a comparison of Tay’s rookie season with Jonas’ rookie season (focusing on per 36): http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/tiny.cgi?id=n8tFl
In my view, he’s not scoring a lot, nor is it very efficient scoring, but he is producing elsewhere.

I personally think there’s a lot of room for growth in Jonas’ game, similar to how there was room in Tay’s game. He doesn’t take a lot of bad shots. He’s been decent defensively. He rebounds quite well. And although his percentage isn’t good, he has good mechanics in his jumpshot. (And for the record, his shooting isn’t worse than Stuckey’s, and JJ’s only a rookie).

Is JJ a starter-caliber player in this league? Certainly not now and probably not in the future, and especially not with this roster. But, I think he is the best option for right now, and he’s probably pretty close to locking up consistent backup minutes once Tay’s healthy.

@br:
I totally agree— watching the rookies and bench players was the most exciting part of the few last seasons for me, and now that we have starting opportunities for these players (not to mention new signees), this season will be exciting to watch regardless of our w/l record.

While I don’t disagree with your opinion of Jerebko, I certainly do think Summers poses a solid alternative with Prince out of the game— especially going into Wednesday night’s game against Cleveland.

Jerebko is solid on defense when he has a height/size advantage over the player he’s guarding. He’s been solid when we’ve switched things up and placed him on guards— kobe, brandon roy, etc. But against players of his size and larger, he’s not been a good defender.

Watching Summers body up Stoudamire on Sunday changed my opinion of him quite a bit. Not only does he appear capable on team defense, but he has the size to give big SFs and even PFs trouble. Plus:

but it’s not as if it’s obvious that Summers is actually a better scorer

He needs PT to prove that. Our starting SF is injured. Jerebko hasn’t shown that he can defend SFs. He also has proven to be a poor shooter. So yeah, I think all signs point to Summers being deserving of extended minutes and/or a start over Jerebko before Prince’s return. If it’s not obvious that Summers is or is not a better scorer, he sure as hell doesn’t have to do much of anything to be an improvement over Jerebko on the offensive end.

He needs PT to prove that

Very fair point.

The only qualifier I’d add to anything you just said is this: We don’t have access to practice. As one hypothetical scenario: It could be that in practice, Jonas simply outworks and/or outplays Daye and Summers. And that could be the reason Jonas starts.

But sure, let’s at least give Summers a go. Sink or swim, DaJuan.

DBB has been literally copying and pasting their keys to the game which is rebounding and you guys are in the thread commenting about how dawrongjuan doesn’t rebound at all. Didn’t he post like a 32 min. 0 reb. outing a couple nights ago? There was his look. Come and gone. Any F who can’t pull down a board is too much of a liability for me.

I think 23 minutes, but yes, 0 rebounds (which Gabe and I bitched about).

But one game is a smaaaalllll sample size, no?

I think to expect gaudy rebounding totals from a guy who guarded mainly perimeter oriented players (Dudley, and to an extent Stoudemire) is completely asinine… That’d be like saying “well why the hell doesn’t insert power forward’s name here get rebounds when he’s checking Sheed/CV/Bosh/Dirk/etc???”.

I believe that G’Town produces the best NBA ready talent on the planet, as much as I disrespect John Thompson. They may not be talented enough to play, but usually the players have the grit and toughness to fight through bouts of poor play.

I also think that Jonas Jerebko is more Dirk Nowitzki than Caron Butler and he should be playing in the post because he has the tenacity to go after offensive rebounds like Wallace and Maxiell do… I feel like Summers is ultimately going to fit right in with this team because of the lack of beef at the 3. He’s more NBA ready than Daye, and while Daye can finesse you, Summers can bang and will bang because he has the build and banged in the Big East

I’m anxious for the Cleveland game, because of the debate we have all just been having.

I think both Jonas and DaJuan will get a crack at covering LBJ. Neither will stop him, but it will be an interesting test.

There’s no stopping what can’t be stopped

/Predator 2’d

@ Skylar

+1 my friend.

@ brgulker

I can honestly say that if DaJuan gets run against LeBron he will get into foul trouble because, having seen him in action, if he gets banged he bangs right back (rimshot)… LeBron is not going to outmuscle DaJuan on the block, it’s when LeBron muscles up and then goes to the finesse game is when the fouls come..

@ Mike Payne

How can I be wrong?

I merely presented my opinion that it appears like in order for DaJuan to get some dap, he needs to average 6 rebounds and put up 13 a night on a consistent basis to be worthy of the selection over Blair in some people’s eyes.

You’re not getting anywhere by continuing to tell me that a 6’7 power forward who can’t move McDyess to the backup center position is more valuable than a 6’8 230lb SF/PF with a midrange game who can guard multiple positions and be effective.

I don’t care what Blair’s “per 36” averages out to because, he averages 5 and 5 and on a per game basis, of the upmost importance when dealing with win/loss record, 5 points and 5 rebounds with average defense isn’t something that is to be overly concerned about. If he puts in 5 and 5 in the playing time afforded to him, then why expect his numbers to extrapolate so greatly over the course of 36 minutes?

It’s like projecting Amir Johnson for the years that we did… sure he’ll put up a 20 and 10 night when give 36 minutes maybe, and that raises up his other averages from the games where he’s only played 3-10 minutes.

At the end of the day? Did I want Summers? No, not particularly after drafting Daye. Is Tayshaun’s contract up after next year? Yes, and I believe that Daye and Summers are more than capable as a 1-2 punch to move forward with in the future. To find a capable backup SF, that we’ve never had, will require the MLE. Having Summers locked down for Jason Maxiell money or less over the next 6 years is something I’m perfectly happy with having.

I don’t believe the “great” numbers put up by Blair in the time he’s played will ever extrapolate well once he’s given playing time. I don’t view Blair as a starter in the NBA, because of his lack of height and offensive and defensive limitations. If Summers ends up being an 8ppg 4rpg with solid defense backup SF per night as a 2nd round pick, I think we should be satisfied with that over another undersized PF.

Interesting points from everyone. I am not overly concerned about JJ’s apparent lack of offense yet. Really, he is doing what he is asked to do and doing it quite well. Just like Summers needs some time to prove himself, so does JJ (and, by the way, we probably shouldn’t really be judging Daye for a least another year).

All three have shown at least some flashes that get me excited for the future. It would be huge for the franchise to have three solid rotation players who can all play multiple positions for mere “pennies”. Right now, it looks like a possibility, but is way to early to know.

@MP You really don’t think JJ can guard SF’s? I thought he’s done quite well. Also, you say he can only guard smaller players, but he has a height advantage over just about every SF out there. Yes, he needs some bulk but he has a good frame (unlike Tay/Daye) that I’m sure will fill out nicely.

I think he’s done quite well……………

@Boney:
Whoa whoa whoa, I’m not getting back into the blair vs. summers debate, and that’s not why I said you were wrong. That shit is tired here, admittedly mostly on the pro-blair side. I’m only talking about this:

How can I be wrong?

In this very thread alone, there is plenty of pro-Summers sentiment. Start at the beginning of this thread and scroll down. When he was in the game, he was getting love here. While you may have been right in the past, before the last game or two, it’s not true now— dude is getting love and attention. It’s not about the totals he put up in that game, he was getting attention and respect here for each play he put up.

So when I say you were wrong, and scntfc was too, is that dude is going to get respect here, and he already has, and its not about his game totals. He looked good on Sunday, he hasn’t looked that good yet, and when he looked good he got the respect of the DBB commenters that were watching the game.

I too am impressed with JJ. sure he hasn’t put up “good” #s yet but he has shown flashes of offensive moves that we haven’t seen on this team in a while.

With the alleged range that he has I think he will be a better offensive threat than Taye. Sorta like a blue collar Dirk.

He has an excellent spin move in the paint, and already has several put back attempts. Once he starts hitting shots on the regular and gets the green light on the three, He should be impressive.

Regarding Blair. someone said that his #s are impressive because he gets them behind Duncan & Dice. He is on a team with several players that know how to make him better. Summers does’nt quite have that luxury.

I was on the pro-Summers bandwagon and while Blair has easily outplayed him so far this year, the Phoenix game was a nice reminder why I was in the bandwagon to begin with. His versatility both offensively and position-wise (I think we had him playing SG at one point) make him have a higher window in my opinion.

He was the one pick I absolutely loved during the draft. Daye I didn’t like and Jerebko I had no feelings on. But I think Summers could be a steal for a second round pick.

@Terrence Lynch:
Agreed, +1. I was firmly in the Blair group, but agree with your opinion of Summers.

I think the reason that Boney made his comment that started this silly argument, is that Gabe and Brgulker harped on the fact that he got 0 rebounds in his 23 minutes. I believe Gabe’s reaction was “yuck”. And for sure, the rebounding issue is concerning, but c’mon – he’s a rookie. Shouldn’t we be looking at the positives (decent shooting and solid defense)? I thought it was a little ridiculous to be jumping all over that. If JJ put up a similar line, I’d be surprised to hear a “yuck” about his performance. Anyways, I don’t necessarily endorse Boney’s argument but it is a little disingenuous to act like there aren’t commenters on this site who are going to be overly critical of TWD.

and Colin wins the thread :)

@Mp:

Thanks Brotha

I look forward to all three rookies eventually being so good that we all argue over which one is more deserving of all-star consideration.

@MP
I don’t know why you’re agreeing with me. That one part was gibberish.

“Higher window?” What the hell does that mean? I’m pretty sure I meant higher ceiling. I somehow combined “Championship Window” and “Higher Ceiling” to form a phrase completely devoid of meaning.

heh, I just read past it and nodded in agreement

“If JJ put up a similar line, I’d be surprised to hear a "yuck" about his performance.”

I’ve admitted to being biased against Summers. With that said, the main reason I prefer JJ to Summers is that I would be shocked if JJ played 23 minutes and put up these non-scoring numbers: 0 rebounds, 0 assists, 1 steal, 0 blocks. I didn’t get to watch the game, so it’s possible I’m way off, and Summers played great.

From looking at his college history, my main concern with Summers has always been that he is the type of player who superficially seems like he’s helping the team: “He’s a scorer! And looks like an NBA player!” But his positive contributions are actually fairly limited (slightly above average scoring) and his weaknesses (almost complete lack of secondary skills/abilities) tend to outweigh his strengths. That is why that particular stat line got a “yuck” from me, as it was exactly what I don’t want to see out of Summers.

@terrence:
It was your sentiment, it was solid. I’m with you on that, whether your grammar was goofy or not. I didn’t notice!

Did anyone see the piston article in the free press today ,that mentioned how Kwame had lost his spot in the rotation to Wilcox.What the hells going on with that, unless JOD’s trying to showcase him as a trade add in, in a couple of weeks.I thoght Kwame was doing alright so far, tho I didn’t see mch of the last two games.Sorry about not posting a link can never seem to get that to work.

Honestly, with the lack of frontcourt scoring, Summers should really get more rotation minutes. Yeah, he ain’t gonna rebound, block, or assist, but dammit neither do Wilcox or Maxiell (much). And Summers at least provides more offensively. Honestly, I’d love to see him get 15-20 minutes a game even when Prince gets healthy. We know Daye is a project and we won’t see gains for the next couple seasons. I’d move Daye completely out of the rotation, especially once we’re healthy, and make Summers the first forward off the bench (regardless of SF or PF).

@ Mike Payne, Terrence Lynch:

Mixing phrases can be fun. I heard a woman in public say something wasn’t “her bag of tea.” Pretty good.

@Defor

It’s pretty much speculation, as Kuester has come out and said Kwame is a “big part” of what we’re doing here.

I think Kuester is just experimenting, trying to find a big man worth a damn. Don’t be surprised if someone else becomes the odd man out.

@TDP:
You Iowa MFers are sick in the brain. (which, uh, makes me guilty too)

@Defor:

“Did anyone see the piston article in the free press today ,that mentioned how Kwame had lost his spot in the rotation to Wilcox.”

Saw that, and I can’t really understand it either. The only reasoning I can see for Wilcox over Kwame would be his ability to run the floor a bit better against a team like Phoenix. Beyond that I’m stumped.

Ex-Piston’s watch:

Spellcheck- 15 points on 6 for 8 fga’s, 8 rebs, 4 asts, 1 stl, 1 blk, 1 to. Just against the Nets, but still solid. Nice to see him take advantage of an opportunity.

The Raptors media are LOVING Amir, too. He’s not putting up huge numbers but he’s contributing and he doesn’t look like the bumbling young’un he was while he was here.

That’s awesome Garrett. I hope he learns alot & ups his game over the next couple seasons.

We are the Knights of Kwame. His loss of rotationship displeases us. A pox on ye, Chris Wilcox.

A Chris Wilpox, if you will

I was a big Afflalo fan and pretty anti-Bynum last year. So I was pretty pissed off about trading him and keeping Bynum. But I’m glad Bynum is proving me wrong.

And I’m still pulling for Amir. I like what the kid provides.

Also, Amir is my twin brother.

Aww yeah, 5/1/1987.

Oh snap! You were born in 1987? I knew I was old, but now I feel REALLY old! :O

some interesting #s, Amir’s avg is 5 and 5 in 17 mins. per. while at this point he is overpaid for those #s, It’s no stretch that he can become a 10 and 10 guy. If he gets more blocks he will be a Tyson Chandler type guy.

Speaking of 5 and 5s JJ is at that mark as well.

@ Terrence Lynch

Dude, Do you know if his girl has any sisters?
http://www.daylife.com/photo/01IP0Nd3KX1PF?q=Amir+Johnson

No idea. Let’s just say he and I don’t share the same taste in women. As in, he likes them. I don’t.

@scntfc:
some interesting #s, Amir’s avg is 5 and 5 in 17 mins. per

Thank the holy lord that 5 and 5 didn’t come from a player for San Antonio. You’d be shitting on them like your life depended on it.

@Terrence:
No idea. Let’s just say he and I don’t share the same taste in women. As in, he likes them. I don’t.

As long as you love the Pistons, it don’t matter. This community is nothing if not progressive.

@ Mike Payne
I never shitted on Blair, I like Blair as well. I just hated all of the weeping over Blair When Summers hasn’t had the oppurtunity to play. It’s not the Piston way. We always made do with what we had.

There should be a team of ex-Pistons just to make us all angry. Amir, Afflalo, Chauncey, Okur, and Grant Hill. With Deron Washington as 6th man.

@Terrence:
You don’t have to like women to have a profound appreciation for this ones beautifull eyes.

Add Sheed and Dice, Mikki Moore, mike James and MCIAFI as coach and you just might have a .500 team, nevermind.

Eh, I probably shouldn’t get further into my personal life, but here’s the thing: it’s not that there is a lack of physical attraction (I would have considered myself bi-sexual as little as a year ago), it’s that I can’t stand their personalities. And it hasn’t been just one or two bad experiences. Pretty much every woman I’ve dated has had this problem. And I rarely have this problem with men. So it’s kind of a no-brainer at this point: I’m attracted to both sexes physically, yet my personality is almost always more compatible with men. Could I date a woman again? Sure, but I find it highly unlikely.

I’m still waiting for the day where I can legally propose to my boyfriend during a Piston game.

Probably didn’t need to say this, but what the hell it’s 3 in the morning and I’m slightly intoxicated.

@Terrence

Hey, I can’t stand women’s personalities, either. Well, maybe just my soon-to-be-ex-wife’s.

@ Colin @ Mike Payne

I didn’t type what I typed to start an argument, nor do I really believe that anyone here wants to see Summers fail. What I do believe is that everyone that is in “Camp Blair” is itching for Summers to screw up so they can point and say “yeah, I knew it all along”…

with the way the debates went back and forth here for the longest time that’s the feeling I got… I don’t want to argue about it, we all support the team. I don’t necessarily believe that blaming Joe Dumars is the right thing to do because the guy could pan out to be an asset, and could be somewhat of a wild card when it comes down to acquiring talent for virtually scraps and potential.

With all that being said, I still don’t believe either Summers or Blair will be much more than a serviceable rotation piece in the NBA. I could be wrong about both but… i think Blair is pegged to be only a rebounder/Malik Rose type while Summers could be like a Rasual Butler/poor man’s Boris Diaw type… Neither are great at anything except for Blair at rebounding.

I think we would’ve given up too much ground in our front court having drafted Blair and having Maxiell on the team too… Sure Wilcox doesn’t play, but he’ll play tonight against Shaq or Z. Blair couldn’t check a guy like Shaq or D Howard, or even outrebound them.

That’s just my belief… I just felt like for the guy to get any love he had to put up 13 and 6 a night to get more love than a guy who is likely starting out of position (Jerebko) and is 3-4 inches shorter. I also believe that Summers rebounding totals from the other night are more of indication of Phoenix’s propensity to hang around the mid-range and perimeter than it is Summers not wanting to bang and get rebounds… but that’s just me

Let’s keep the focus on the ‘Stones, not sexual preferences. Thanks. To each his own, not judging anyone but I don’t come here to discuss sexually, I come to discuss basketball. Happy Thanksgiving everyone!!!

@ Boney,
I agree 100% I’ve read more posts about “Joe screwed up he didn’t draft Blair” Then I have " Summers needs to get some playing time"

It’s like he’s been written off before we actualy get to see him.

That’s was the majority sentiment here, but it’s ok. MFWB had a couple detractors here and there early on as well, and some less than favorable reviews from his Israeli days. Not comparing the two, but you never know who may surprise you during the season, if given the chance.

T-Lynch, Michigan as I’m sure you know may very well vote positively for gay marriage in the near future. You might get your chance to marry that dude within the next decade, here’s hoping.

Or you could become a Raptors fan and propose in Toronto. The Raptors suck, though.