McDyess may (eventually) start

How can players respect or value what you say when you change your mind every other game on how things should be done or who should be playing? Wasn’t it just a week ago Curry said Amir was going to be starting for the rest of the year?

All summer Curry stressed defense, rebounding and points in the paint as well as using our depth. Half the season we’ve played small ball which went against everything he said all summer. Sheed and Dyess are playing a ton of minutes as well as Tay even though Curry talked about how we can’t do that to them since it wears them down. Maxiell is playing 5 minutes less per game compared to last year. Curry said Amir needs consistent minutes to get better, but he jerks him in and out of the rotation.

I’m not against Dyess starting, he’s been a great rebounder and provided a ton of energy whenever he plays. It’s just another example of Curry being unable to make up his mind and provide any consistency and stability to this team.

Sheed to San Antonio?

ditto

What Jim said.

I agree. We need Amir or Max on the floor at the 4 spot as much as is possible to provide athleticism and speed, especially when AI is on the court pushing the basketball. Both of them are fast enough to fill the middle lane and finish on the break or follow up any missed shots on fast breaks (like Amir did against Cleveland so well).

One thing I would add:

I think it’s much more important to decide who’s finishing games, not starting them.

Is it AI? Is it Rip? Is it AI at SG and Rip at SF? We’ve seen combinations of all three of these at the end of games lately, and it’s making for some sloppy, incoherent basketball.

Here’s hoping we’re spending more time thinking about closing than starting.

Is Curry a puppet of Joe D? Could his complete lack of consistency be the result of having another mans hand in his anus?

I like the idea, but also agree that Max should get more minutes not only for easy baskets but when he’s hustling it forces everyone to hustle, because if not they’re painfully obvious.

Second, I can’t help but think this is laying the ground work for Roscoe to be traded and this kinda puts the thought in Dyess’ head. Put Dyess in the middle, Amare and Tay with AI & Stuck. That’s an up and down court team and then bring in Rip/Max/Amir/AA with a little seasoning of Bynum and the philosophy doesn’t change all that much.

If not, we take our spot, like our wounds and throw 30M at 2 FA’s this summer. Also, I believe Boozer says he’ll be ready to play 17-Feb. An audition? I hate the idea of signing him. Too fragile. I’d set my sights on Milsap. But then again, it doesn’t appear MC likes hustling, smallish 4’s given his treatment of Max so far.

Doesn’t it seem a bit ridiculous that every solution they come up with is any but AI coming off the bench?

Seriously… it’s like a run-on joke that just keeps going and going and going… and just when you think it’s over BAAAAM there it is again. I’ve stopped laughing at the joke. I’m just gonna sit and wait until Chuckles the clown (that’d be Curry) runs out of steam.

It’s looking more and more like Michael Curry’s long lost twin brother escaped from a mental institution this summer, tied him up and left him the broom closet of his new rent controlled apartment, and then took over his new job as head coach.

Has any head coach ever seemed as schizophrenic and unpredictable as Curry? We’ve had bad coaches before, but at least they went down sticking to their guns.

Curry seems to be grasping at straws. He knows the team should be playing better and has absolutely no freaking clue what to do about it.

Bring back George Irvine. George- are you out there?

I’ve posted this before, but for anyone that hasn’t seen it: this is from Michael Curry’s introductory press conference, if you skip to about the 1min:30sec mark, you get Michael Curry explaining his “philosophy.” It’s pretty awesome.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GKw8W0EVbsI&feature=PlayList&p=AB5E2DDA5CC445C7&playnext=1&index=60

It goes pretty far toward explaining why our team frequently seems to have no idea what they should be doing…

Big Z: I agree. The thing that bothers me most was in his press conference MC said defense, hustle and holding guys accountable. I don’t know how you hold guys accountable unless you play them consistently.

Something tells me Curry is on the hot seat. (I know, Duh!!) I can’t believe Joe D thought this would go down this way, even after trading CB. At the beginning of every month of the season, I think if you asked MC the question “what’s your emphasis” you’d get a different answer for each month. Accountability/hustle. Small Ball. Deciding who’s going to be 6th man (AI or Rip). Practicing in our own building rather than practice gym. Amir/Kwame/Dyess in starting lineup. Christ, it never ends. And this from the guy who said he wasn’t going to accept excuses? I guess you don’t have to provide an excuse if you’re always trying something different because it makes you look like you’re trying, sio how can you evaluate?

I can see Joe D thinking that CB being here would hlep MC somewhat find his way. But also it was Joe D who said someone would be traded so it’s not like he didn’t think things would change. I think because of MC’s career and saying the right things in an interview, Joe D thought he was getting someone else. Offering suggestions as an assistant can make you look good when a good coach implements them. When you’ve got to make a decision or come up with something on your own on the spot and can’t, you’re in trouble. Coaching is managing the roster and the game and so far MC has shown the ability to do neither.

If Joe D says what he means, particularly after game 6 last year, then he can’t help but dump Curry. There is no consistency. There is still that non-chalant, “what, me worry” attitude. No matter what excuse MC gives for changing the lineup. AI shoots 43% and gives out 6 dimes and that’s what we’re looking for from him? That’s a good day? Sheed’s still jacking 3’s when everyone knows he’s our only low post presence. Max hustle’s his ass off and makes a few mistakes and gets a bunch of DCP-CDs? Amir starts. Then subs. The tops. Then, DNP-CD. Then is back in the starting lineup? No wonder the kid’s confused. AI has the ball go between his legs while not paying attention after calling for the ball. . . on a very soft pass.

MC’s not coaching, he’s throwing sh!t against the wall and hoping that something will stick. The pistons for the most part are a known quantity. You coach and get the most out of what you have. Curry’s still trying to find out what he has instead of coaching what he has. I saw the last time out agaisnt the Heat and from my recollection, it didn’t look as though hardly anybody was paying attention. Everyone knew Wade would have the ball. All I heard was “No 3’s.” Did everyone know Tay was going to try and follow Wade? I don’t remember hearing it. And since it wasn’t called, we’re now at a disadvantage. Was it discussed in the TO?

The chemistry problem is because Curry cannot settle on a starting line-up and stick with it to the end of the game!

The fourth Quarter comes along and you see starters sitting the bench so bench players can play and you lose the chemistry and the game!

Curry is the one messing up the chemistry.
Curry has GOT to go….!!!!

ALSO….
Stop with the excuses! Detroit has the players to win the championship. If Brown were the coach, you would not see this crap playing.

Age is not a factor, at least not with the Boston Celtics and Ray Allen, Kevin Garnet, and Paul Pierce. More excuses!

And, when Hamilton was sitting out with injuries, they had a 7-1 winning streak! Injuries are not the problem. More excuses!

All excuses to cover-up the problem – it is the COACH!!

PLEASE, get rid of Curry, and get a coach that can take these great players and start winning again!

Oh, and how in the world does anyone think they are going to get ANY fab player want to play for Curry? They want a coach that can take them to the championships, and that is not going to be Curry who still thinks he is "transitioning" after 20-30+ games!! Another excuse!

You can have all the right tools, but if you don’t know what to do with them, you get nothing done, or you create a catastrophe!!
Curry has GOT to go because he is a TOOL and the wrong one!
Heat and Pistons:

Curry is losing the games and messing up the chemistry and the pace of the game. Will he ever figure out to leave in the line-up that is making it happen???

FIRE CURRY – PLEASE! And soon…!!!

Why fix McDyess when he’s not broken? Leave him where he is. We’ve seen the guy enough to know that he doesn’t adjust to change well. I say Dyess should stay on the bench and keep doing what he’s doing.

I still feel bad that McDyess came back to………this. :\

I miss Rick Carlisle.

“Has any head coach ever seemed as schizophrenic and unpredictable as Curry?”

Yes. Lots of them.

Look, Curry is a bit overwhelmed as a rookie head coach, but there are reasons beyond that that explain what is going on.

When Joey D keeps repeating “this is a transition year”, he seems to really not be joking.

What that seems to mean is that winning really isn’t the objective, because as I’ve often stated, we have a roster that could easily put itself in position to steal a championship this year if a few breaks fell our way.

But management isn’t even TRYING to put us in that position, veteran players are good at picking up that management isn’t even trying to win, and thus, things fall apart.

Joey D has done multiple things to take the focus off of Joey D, but that doesn’t mean that isn’t where the focus really should belong.

There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics.

According to the execrable “Win Shares” metric, Zeke and Joe Dumars were among the least deserving all-stars of all time, far worse choices than Chuck was this year.

For a team that not long ago set the record for most consecutive games of the same starting lineup, this is a little frustrating.

“For a team that not long ago set the record for most consecutive games of the same starting lineup, this is a little frustrating.”

You still don’t have any kind of clue about the pain you’re in for over the next five years, do you, Shinons?

The cupboard is bare for trades. Cap space is only useful for bringing in role players. Get used to musical chairs…

We’re set for the long term at point guard, we’re set at shooting guard until 2013, we’re set at small forward until at least 2011, have a couple young bigs who could fill one frontcourt spot and cap space for another one (whether via trade or free agency). Yeah. We’re really screwed.

“You still don’t have any kind of clue about the pain you’re in for over the next five years, do you, Shinons?”

On the brightside, Petey, you’ll be long gone.

“On the brightside, Petey, you’ll be long gone.”

And it’s easier to get into popular restaurants due to the economic downturn.

There is always an upside to the downside, but still…

Petey: You don’t make any sense:

“What that seems to mean is that winning really isn’t the objective, because as I’ve often stated, we have a roster that could easily put itself in position to steal a championship this year if a few breaks fell our way.

But management isn’t even TRYING to put us in that position, veteran players are good at picking up that management isn’t even trying to win, and thus, things fall apart."

Management? Curry is picking the rotation. If managment truly believes this is “transition” why isn’t Max/Amir getting more burn? AA?

If we have a roster to steal a championship but management says it a transition year, the rotations make no sense then because the youngins aren’t getting any burn. Joe D says transition year, the starters are getting the bulk of the minutes but they’re mad because of the word “transition” so they play WTF do I care basketball? Makes no sense. Regardless of who is saying transition.

Petey: I mean, if we have the roster, isn’t it because of management?

That would mean those not putting us in position is coaching, would it not.

“Petey: I mean, if we have the roster, isn’t it because of management? That would mean those not putting us in position is coaching, would it not.”

I believe, (along with team vets, if Vescey’s rumor is to be believed), that rotations and gameplans are not being determined by Curry alone.

“If we have a roster to steal a championship but management says it a transition year, the rotations make no sense then because the youngins aren’t getting any burn.”

I think management has an agenda which is determined by other factors than trying to win this year. But I don’t think their agenda is all about just ‘playing the youngins’. I think marketing issues are playing an outsize factor in their agenda at the moment.

The resulting scheme is not about tanking or about player development, but neither is it about putting the current roster in a position to go as far as it might go this spring.

But there are other viable hypotheses, including the ever-popular MCIAFI scenario, and the Joey D has a trade in mind scenario. But I think the marketing scenario is most likely…

Putting your groceries on the shelves in different arrangements doesn’t make you a cook. It’s how the ingredients work together in the pan on the stove that counts. Any fool can make out a lineup. The question is when the ball goes up can you coach well enough to win the game. This move does nothing to answer that question.

Joe-cubed: +1

Petey: Marketing might have something to do with it. But these “rotations” based on the non-sellout vs. Heat can’t be the real reason, or should I result Joe D wanted. You won’t convince me that folks seeing us playing .500 ball while not playing the youngsters is the plan. From what I’ve seen, people go nuts for Max’s hustle. Amir also. They like the tough D by AA. People will accept that product during “transition” but not vets bitching at refs while playing .500 Because as you said, we do have talent on this roster.

A trade I think may definitely be out there. I think Joe’s partner might be holding out for something more, either from Joe or another team.

“including the ever-popular MCIAFI scenario, " I’d put that not only ever-popular, but first. Which will make it extremely hard to land a great FA, in 09 or 10.

“According to the execrable "Win Shares" metric, Zeke and Joe Dumars were among the least deserving all-stars of all time, far worse choices than Chuck was this year.”

The selections in question were pretty bad, so I have no trouble with them being on the list. That said, I was at BW3, watching an all-star flashback game with Mookie Blaylock and BJ Armstrong… That was a lean year. What the chart doesn’t measure is performance relative to “snubs”.

You know how MC has some games where he does a reasonable job most of the times and is only incomprehensible sporadically? Petey is kind of the same way where most of the time he’s just totally obnoxious, but has some threads where he’s tolerable. This is a PIAFI thread.

For once… and only once… I agree with Petey. I don’t think Curry’s a great coach, but I’ve heard blurbs here and there that suggest that he’s playing who Dumars wants. I read something about how there’s 3 factions in the locker room: old school (Tey, Dyess, Rip, and Sheed), new school (Maxiell, Amir, and Stuckey), and AI. There were a couple other articles I read that made me rethink these moves.

Even if all the decisions are being made by Curry, what does that say about Dumars to allow your hand-picked successor to field this garbage. Either he’s a terrible coach that you hand-picked, or you’re tanking intentionally. Of course Dumars can do no wrong… so he must be tanking intentionally and Curry will be the greatest coach of all time… next year… or the year after that. Right??? God, I hope that’s the case.

@Shinons:
Agreed. I have a feeling that I could have a beer with Petey and genuinely enjoy the guy. 1/3 comments has me putting my face in my palm, most of the time the others are solid.

@Kevin S.:
Interesting anecdote. I was firebombed at a BW3 one time, and I demanded that I wouldn’t pay my bill until they told me what the hell the third W was for. I was bluffing, of course, but only the manager knew— Weck, which the company no longer serves, but yet that third W remains…

Old School / New School / AI’s posse seems plausible. But I also think it has to do with how they’re being used by MC. For sake of arguement, then the old school guys are just pissed off because CB got traded from what I see. So Freakin’ what!! That does not excuse their play, i.e., inconsistent, etc. And lending credence to this thought is if it was happening before, Dyess wouldn’t have come back, so odds are it’s post trade. Obvioiusly Rip was pissed. If Joe D is calling the shots, the vets are getting their minutes, and then some, recently. How many times were we suppose to listen to, “give us one more try.”

Do you think Sheed likes watching Amir and Max sprint up the court and actually try for points in the paint? You think Tay likes watching AI inconsisently try to fight thru pics and gamble consistently? I think these guys had been playing together and become so familiar with each other that, yes, they all knew what the other was going to do and where to be. But, that didn’t work for the last 4 years. They lost to inferior talent in 06 and 07. They had as much talent at the celts last year. At the end of the day, they didn’t get it done. And that’s how Joe measured them.

They each got into a comfort zone and wanted it to continue. Challenge for a title. Come up one series short. And say we’ll do better next year. How many “we all shoulda had that game” from Sheed was Joe suppose to listen to? Granted, they came up short together, but something had to change.

Mike,

I think your waiter was pulling your leg (no pun intended, if you discovered one).

When I was in Chicago in 2000, they had chicken wings for 10 cents Monday night. Friggin’ ethanol…

If you want to know what I’m thinking, you’ll get a boner just by looking at that Clippers’ roster and seeing #10 on it.

/Lawyerboy’d

I do agree that when Joe D said everyone is on the table except Stuck, he did put Stuck in a no win situation. Especially after he traded CB. .

Like it or not, Stuck is the future as it stands right now. Throw in Amir and Max, though these guys aren’t taking anyone’s minutes, what exactly do the vets have to be pissed about. Hell, Sheed was at Curry’s presser.

But I do like old/new school theory. These guys are afraid that after Joe D pulled the trigger on CB, he might be pulling the trigger on them and send them to “not so good a team.” Now, they are not only not part of contending team, they’ve got to play for a contract, speaking of Sheed of course. Joe D extension of Rip suggest he wants Rip around and as a good influence on Stuck.

I think the old school guys are pretty much in the same corner I am… start Rip over AI. Which is another reason I think it’s a manufactured stance that Curry (and probably Dumars) has taken. Maybe the old way isn’t gonna win us a championship… but it sure as hell would look alot better than what we’re seeing out there right now.

I figured out the trade that’s gonna make us champions again!!!

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=366~3235~1977~2806&teams=28~28~8~8&te=&cash=

I think the conspiracy theories are a bit far-fetched. Occam’s razor says MCIAFI. And if that’s not the case and JDIAFI, then MCIAFI for taking the job and ruining his career by doing what Dumars wants him to do (which clearly isn’t working).

Btw, I heard SA is eyeing Sheed via ESPN. The thing is, looking at the salaries on that roster, I don’t see anything that they could offer that would make us want to trade him… aside from Parker, Ginobli, or Duncan. I just don’t see it.

I don’t buy the MC as Joe D.‘s puppet. It just doesn’t make sense. If he clashed with Carslisle and Flip about giving playing time to the younger guys, why would he promote Tay and AI playing 40+ minutes per game? If he signed Rip and Max to extensions this season, why would he promote cutting their minutes?

Surely MC knows that the buck stops with him and he’s not going to get to keep his job with a .500 record, even if he is getting Joe D.‘s blame. Larry Bird fired his old buddy Carslisle even though it was Bird who demolished that franchise and Carslisle did a beyond admirable job handling that team. I think that too often MC gets too focused on the name on the back of the jersey rather than what they’re producing on the court.

Brad,

That article says that it would most likely happen in Free Agency next summer.

Garrett:

+ Infinity

I want to claw my eyes out whenever I read a post from some asshole on this blog who thinks he knows how Rip’s mind works or Joe D’s master strategy. At least Peter Vescey has a column.

OT: Did you guys see the 3-point competition participants? Roger Mason and Daequan Cook? Really? What, Steve Novak was busy? I know Roger Mason is shooting well this season, but couldn’t they have gotten some bigger names, like Kevin Durant (who is actually shooting fairly well) or Ray Allen?

This is the simplest Sheed-to-SA deal that I can think of…

’Sheed, Acker, Bynum to SA for Bowen, Kurt Thomas, Roger Mason

It’s kind of fair. Detroit preserves all of the cap space for 2010, gets a good rotation player in Mason, a backup for Tay in Bowen, depth in the front court. SA is an ideal situation for ’Sheed. Playing next to Duncan is probably the only thing at this point in his career that is going to keep him focused. I think he respects Duncan too much to not play the right way.

joe-cubed: We’ve got space in 09 if we keep sheed. As for Bowen, even Kandahar ain’t that good. Dude is practically wearing orthopedics now.

MarkButter in SoCal – The Pistons would still have Iverson’s cap space if they trade Rasheed to SA. I don’t think anybody needs $33 million dollars in cap space for the 2009 free agent class.

I think the Pistons should try and get a pu-pu platter of guys like Anderson Varejao and Trevor Ariza and Anthony Parker in ’09 and then save enough cap space for ’10 to get one max player.

We wouldn’t have 33 million in cap space. We’re already like 12 mil above the cap. We’ll have around 20 something in cap space next year if both Ai and Sheed come off the books.

Colin: it’s my understandng that we are over the cap, but not over the luxury tax cap, which is where Mr. Davidson doesn’t want to go. In fact, most teams are over the cap. People are shedding contracts to avoid the luxury tax.

Joe-cubed: Don’t see how the poo-poo platter helps us. I would like Ariza, but he can’t play the 4 and he’s not coming here to back up Tay. No FA is coming to Detroit without pieces in place. Tay/Stuck/Rip is a start, but Max & Amir aren’t going to change someone’s mind. The only option is to trade Sheed to someone looking for cap space and willing to trade a big with a low post game.

At any rate, the next two weeks will be interesting.

Any big trade before the deadline will involve shoring up the low post game, the Pistons’ MAJOR weakness. If Rasheed goes, expect another, better, big man in return. Hopefully, we can get a dominant(ish) frontcourt player to go with Rasheed by sending away a guard (rip, anyone?).

Any small trade will involve a Walter Hermann-like player who will command more minutes and be a threat from behind the arc.

I don’t see any trade like the one joe-cubed describes with SA. The Spurs would love it, but it would leave the Pistons without ANY starter-worthy big men.

And Dumars will NOT sit on his cap-space until 2010. He doesn’t need to, since he can pick up someone Boozer-caliber and instantly turn the Pistons into championship caliber (if they keep either Sheed or AI) and it would doom the team to failure in 2009. The AI trade was not made for only the future in mind. Joe is smart enough to be able to pull off deals without being that simplistic.

Which number will Amare wear when he plays here?

@TDP:
Hopefully #1.

Wait a minute! What will AI wear? #3? We’re trading Stuckey? Panic!

The rotation problem seems pretty simple to me…

Depth Chart:
PG: Stuckey, Iverson, Bynum.
SG: Hamilton, Afflalo, Acker.
SF: Prince, Herrmann, Sharpe.
PF: McDyess, Maxiell, Johnson.
C: Wallace, Brown.

-Start and finish games with Stuckey, Hamilton, Prince, McDyess, and Wallace.

-Use Iverson as the 6th man.

-Limit the minutes of:
   -Hamilton and Prince to 32.
   -Iverson and Stuckey to 30.
   -McDyess and Wallace to 28.

-Which leaves:
   -20 for Afflalo/ Herrmann.
   -40 for Brown/ Johnson/ Maxiell.

-Strictly save Acker, Bynum, and Sharpe for blowouts and/or injuries.

Dumars cannot hold Curry’s hand during game time decision making, and that is where it is falling apart!

What player in the NBA wants to come and play for Curry!? They all want a championship, and Curry is not going to get any team to that no matter what players he has. You will find the starters sitting the bench in the 4th Quarter and losing the game when they had a solid lead – that is if you can ever figure out who Curry’s starting players are?

You are all over thinking this whole thing. Dumars and Company were trying to save $$’s by going with Curry. Dumars thought he could “tutor” him or hold his hand and get through the season, but Dumars is probably no more of a coach then Isaih Thomas was. You have the blind leading the blind.

The Piston players can win a championship if you have a coach that knows what to do with them!

Maybe Dumars needs to go if he actually sticks with Curry through any more miserable games. It isn’t fair to the players or the fans!

I think I am going to stop watching the Pistons, and go to the local Class B High School games – the coaching is better!

“If you want to know what I’m thinking, you’ll get a boner just by looking at that Clippers’ roster and seeing #10 on it.”

Boney, that was just stupid.

“Btw, I heard SA is eyeing Sheed via ESPN. The thing is, looking at the salaries on that roster, I don’t see anything that they could offer that would make us want to trade him…”

Funny, I was thinking the same thing about Denver this past summer.

Re: Why I like Ariza, Varejao, Anthony Parker in ’09

Ariza: I think the smart way to go in the NBA is to spread minutes on a deep team similar to Euro ball and much like San Antonio and Portland do now. Ariza is a great player to put on the court with a lead because he’s such a good disruptive defender that it makes it hard to make a run. With good Pistons teams every few games used to be a blowout and a player like Ariza could get 30 minutes on a semi-regular basis if the Pistons are good again. I don’t think Tay minds being well rested and only getting 30 minutes a game, especially on tough cover nights against Pierce and LeBron.

Varejao: If Rip is a building block for the next 4 years, somebody has to enjoy setting picks and doing dirty work. I think Varejao has really grown up the last few years and if the LeBron to NYC thing is likely then why would you want to stay in Cleveland on a long term deal?

Anthony Parker: He’s versatile and should be inexpensive at age 35 and gives you plus size and rebounding at G.

I think the economy is going to hurt the market for all the ‘09 free agents but more so for second-tier guys so I think it’s smart to grab those guys up at what I think will be a discount.

An 8 man rotation of…
PG – Stuckey, Parker
SG – Rip, Parker
SF – Tay, Ariza
PF – Amir, McDyess
C – Varejao, McDyess

…is pretty good. Ariza is 6’8" and a very good defender at SF. You have to be able to defend the SF and defend the 3pt shot to get out of the East and I think this kind of team can do just that. And Dumars still has Maxiell, Afflalo, and a 1st round pick as assets to make the puzzle work.

Then add FPCB in 2010.

@joejoejoe:
If that is our roster next season, I will knife myself. Don’t get me wrong, I always love your comments. But that roster… ugh.

@Mike Payne:
I forgot we’d have Bowen, Kurt Thomas, and Roger Mason too. Does that change anything for you? Probably makes you want to use a gun instead of knife. The Stones would be me-deep-ocre. That said, I can live with a gritty team with improving young talent that wins 45 games easier than I can live with the hot mess we have this year.

Aging all-stars! Head cases! Divas! DNP-CDs! Step right up! Ugh.

Mark Butter,

My point was that you can’t go over the cap to sign a FA. You can only do that with the MLE or to resign your own guy. Also, we are over the luxury tax limit. I’m sure Mr. D wants to get under, but in terms of FA signings, the Salary cap is the relevant figure, not the luxury tax.