Somewhere, DBB reader Mike just exhaled.

So we trade a young pf to save 3.6 mil? Thats not that much savings. I dont see the point.

I guess its good I didnt buy my free amir shirt yet.

No, the Pistons are saving $166,000 … both contracts expire after this coming season.

I guess Joe did free Amir…..

I am devastated. Amir has finally been freed. Somewhere Mike has a single tear falling down his cheek. How will he finish his posts now?

“RealGM Note: The move will save Detroit in their salary cap space pursuits, as Oberto’s contract is non-guaranteed.”

source: http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/60013/20090623/detroit_trades_amir_johnson_to_bucks/

Wow. Truly the end of an era.

this is just fantastic. Now lets go draft BJ Mullens with Jrue Holiday/ Jonny Flynn, Ty Lawson, Earl Clark or any other player that is better than him on the board.

Then lets use the savings of Amir to pay Ben Gordon even more. And Carlos Boozer.

Then lets sign Curry to an extension.

Then we go draft at 15 next year! /end rant

It just doesnt make sense to me. Atleast we have an extra big. Or packaged him in a trade for someone better. Hell even a draft pick. Its better than just cap space in a summer where the top two free agents have huge question marks.

If cap space wasnt the reason, I fail to see how Oberto is better than Amir. In any scenerio, I dont like it and it doesnt make sense.

This is a cap dump. I can’t see us keeping Oberto. I don’t really agree with dumping Johnson though. Why not just hang on to him for one more season during his contract season?

TRADE AMIR NOW

Hopefully somewhere Mike is hanging from end of a rope with his Amir jersey wrapped around his balls

/too soon?

I mentioned in my blog, http://motor-citysports.blogspot.com/, that this does free up the cap space necessary to acquire another 1st round pick, as has been speculated we might do.

So we have two bigs now? Max and Kwame. And trent? Tay back at pf? That worked so well. Gah

This is a good deal. Oberto is better then Johnson, and if it doesn’t pan out he’s gone. Low risk, low reward but an upgrade.

This is a cap dump. I can’t see us keeping Oberto.

Why the hell would Milwaukee, whose balls are up against a razor sharp luxury tax line with two core pieces expiring, trade away a contract they could have ended Oberto’s contract.

I agree wit bones. Oberto is as solid of a center as it gets. This is no kwame brown or desagana diop. This guy is only going to help us. Good move.

In terms of next season, this is not a good deal. Oberto is not an upgrade, and he probably won’t even be on the team. But, if we get another 1st round pick with that salary, then this could turn out to be a good deal.

If no other first round pick is acquired, then this is a terrible deal. No other way to say it. Losing Johnson would not be worth only $2 million in cap space this off-season.

But, like I said, I think this gets us another 1st round pick without tapping into our money we need for the free agency market.

WTF

Oberto HELPS???

LOL

Oberto is a solid baller. If the Pistons are resigning Herrmann I could see the two of them playing together on a very capable second unit.

I don’t know the ins and outs of the cap to offer an opinion on Amir’s $3.66M vs. Oberto’s $3.5M number.

Trade Oberto now!

“Why the hell would Milwaukee, whose balls are up against a razor sharp luxury tax line with two core pieces expiring, trade away a contract they could have ended Oberto’s contract.”

-They saved 3 million just in the Jefferson deal in the exchange of salaries. So, they are at roughly 61 million, now. The luxury tax is still a few million away. They can keep Sessions and stay under the luxury tax now.

Matt Watson
Jun 23rd, 2009 at 7:42 pm

Somewhere, DBB reader Mike just exhaled.>>
-————
The Bucks were not one of my teams on Johnson’s wish list.

1. I am not a big Scott Skiles fan. I see Skiles as a more experienced version of Curry. I don;t think it will take long for Skiles to put Johnson in his dog house, but Johnson may surprise.

2. Right now it is questionable where Johnson will get his minutes from especially if the Bucks resign Villaneuva. Alexander is now penciled in at SF. With Villaneuva, Luc Richard and Kurt Thomas PF is probably covered though Thomas may be released.

I think his best bet for minutes will come from backing up Bogut ahead of Gudzuric and Elson.

In any case there is a lot of mediocre talent for the Bucks at the #4 and #5 so Johnson could maybe leap over them.

Howeer, I just don’t see a mesh between Skiles and Johnson. It could even blow up during October.

I think the Bucks took him because Hammond liked Johnson from Hammond’s days with the Pistons.

At this point I would like to see the Bucks trade Johnson. In any case it will probably only be one year maximum for Johnson with the Bucks unless Skiles is gone before next summer.

-Oh, and they will cut Bowen and save $2 million, and probably reach a buyout agreement with Thomas. Not sure why they did this deal, but it does free up more room to sign Sessions and Villanueva.

Boney
Jun 23rd, 2009 at 8:16 pm

Hopefully somewhere Mike is hanging from end of a rope with his Amir jersey wrapped around his balls
======
If you don’t cool it you will find Perez Hilton’s family Jewels rolling around on your tongue.

So, on the heels of Amir being traded Mike would like Amir traded again?

ONE IS NOT ENOUGH TRADE JOHNSON AGAIN.

Somebody keep an eye out on Bucks blogs!

:( Oh well, it’s a shame that everything didn’t click perfectly this past year with Amir. He plays hard and we’ve generally been better with him on the court than off, and I still think there’s a decent chance he ends up being a very useful NBA player, but it was clear that wasn’t going to happen with the Pistons.

No matter what anyone’s opinion on Amir is/was, with him gone (and Oberto likely bought out), we are horrifyingly thin in our frontcourt- our only bigs under contract are Maxiell and Kwame… That is not a recipe for NBA success. It is, on the other hand, a good way to improve ones chances in the draft lottery.

So, on the heels of Amir being traded Mike would like Amir traded again?

ONE IS NOT ENOUGH TRADE JOHNSON AGAIN.

Somebody keep an eye out on Bucks blogs!
======
I won’t be on the Bucks blogs.

The more I think about the Bucks would have been on the bottom of my list of teams for Johnson to go to #29 out of 29.

The only think I like about the Bucks is Hammond and the fact that they have to Bruins; i.e. Gadzuric and Luc Richard.

In any case I am still a Pistons fan after the Clippers and ahead of the Lakers.

However I don’t post on Clippers or Lakers blogs either though this year I might start posting on Clippers blogs, but no Bucks blogs that is for sure.

You know Amir? The way your comments read can certainly be construed as such, IMO.

Oberto’s a solid C, but my guess is that he’ll be gone by July 1st.

Given a choice of teams for Johnson my top 5 in order would have been

1. Thunder
2. Lakers (Clippers are too crowded up front)
3. Knicks
4. Celtics
5. Hornets

4.

Or you can roll with Oberto and Kwame for a year, let them expire and use the MLE on a better Center like Pryzbilla.

Mike = Will.I.Am? Who knew?

Other Matt
Jun 23rd, 2009 at 8:50 pm

You know Amir? The way your comments read can certainly be construed as such, IMO.

===
Never met him, tweeted him or have any contact with him. Have not photos shirts or other memorabilla of him.

I just think he is talented and very good player.

Right now my 5 favaorites players are

1. K. Love
2. K. Durant
3. Kobe
4. B. Griffin
5. E. Gordon

Pryzbilla is not leaving Portland

Oberto is at least servicable, right? I honestly haven’t watched the Spurs much the last couple years. Would we rather have him starting than Kwame?

Remember the AmirMcMax PF monster? Those were the days…

Boney
Jun 23rd, 2009 at 8:56 pm

Mike = Will.I.Am? Who knew?
====
LOL

The only thing you have to know about Oberto: Matt Bonner started over him

Pryzbilla has a player option next year. I could see him opting out for a longer term deal which he probably won’t get unless Portland just gives up on Oden.

Washington just bagged Randy Foye and Mike Miller for Etan Thomas, Darius Songaila and some other dude.

It’s crazy trade day! From the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel comments:

Minnesota Timberwolves just got the #5 pick in the draft (along with Etan Thomas and Darius Songallia) from Washington for Randy Foye and Mike Miller.

The Wizards may be slightly less mediocre this year!

@ Matt Gibson

Agreed. The only way this makes is significant is if we dump Oberto and somehow cop another first rounder like has been discussed.

It’s too bad they didn’t send Amir to Europe for a couple years. That probably would have helped his development.

“Washington just bagged Randy Foye and Mike Miller for Etan Thomas, Darius Songaila and some other dude.”

That other dude will also be the 5th pick in the draft. Washington still needs bigs.

I haven’t made a lot of comments regarding the draft because this draft is just a crap shoot as to who goes where.

Joe. D. said that he wasn’t going to be trading the #15 pick.

If that is the case I would love to see him get Blair.

Blair even with his history of bad knees in high school is a enhanced version of Maxiell. I saw this guy play a lot last season and he is an absolute tenacious rebounder at both ends.

The Pistons need rebounding and Blair could give it to them better than either Bosh, Boozer or Milsap and for a lot less money.

I would like to see the Pistons sign Milsap, draft Blair and move Maxiell.

Kwame will be returning so right now he starts at center. A trade for Bosh doesn’t make much sense since Bosh is too light to play center and Milsap can be gotten without giving up Prince or Hamilton.

I don’t see the Pistons taking Clark. Why

Clark is a less talented than Sharpe. It is not even close. On top of that D. Washington should make ths squad this year backing up Prince at SF.

In anycase a lot of options remain so it will be interesting to see how it unfolds.

Okay, two things.

1) Did we ever really know what we had in the guy? I don’t think so.

2) I haven’t been opposed to trading the kid — but for Oberto? I mean Oberto is a solid enough role player and all… but that’s the best we could do? Couldn’t we have packaged him with someone else for more talent (e.g., Prince + Amir for Kaman?)? Or, worst case scenario, we keep him until the fire sales come around at the trade deadline and move him then. Or even worse than worst case, we give the kid a chance and let him expire this offseason?

Very, very strange start to what will be the first of many moves this offseason.

Clark is significantly more talented than Sharpe. That is just absurd. We are talking about the most talented player on the number one overall seed in the tournament last year. He is legit and his ceiling is at least Lamar Odom. He’s big enough to play the 3 or the 4 and would give us a versatile big guy. I like him, Lawson, or Blair with the first pick.

The T-Wolves now have the 5th and 6th picks.

Getting Rubio and Hardin would be kind of neat. Though neither may last past the 4th pick.

I assume we also got three unprotected first rounders from the bucks, to balance the trade out?

UNTRADE AMIR NOW

Dafa
Jun 23rd, 2009 at 9:16 pm

Clark is significantly more talented than Sharpe
=======
WEAKNESSES:
- Go-to scoring mentality – Sharpe no problem here
- Shot-selection – ditto
- Stuck between 3 and 4 – ditto
- Turnover prone – ditto
- Back to basket scoring – Sharpe has an excellent postup game.
- Off-ball defense – ditto
- Consistency – ditto
- Doesn’t always play hard – Sharpe unknown not enough history
- Focus – probably a little better than Sharpes
- High bust potential? – ditto
- Mental toughness – Sharpe unknown
- Physical Toughness – Sharpe is tougher
- Not productive enough – Sharpe can be a lot more productive
- Ability to finish through contact – No problem for Sharpe
- 3-point shooting percentages – Sharpe is little better there.
- Ability to catch and shoot – unknown
- Ability to shoot off the dribble – Sharpe far better.
- Free throw shooting – Sharpe better
- Low shooting percentages – at same level Sharpe far better
- Relies too heavily on outside shot – Sharpe has all around game on offense.

STRENGTHS:
- Mismatch Potential – ditto
- Pick and roll play – ditto
- Transition play – ditto
- Ability to create own shot – ditto
- Ball-handling skills w/either hand – ditto
- Excellent hands – ditto
- Ability to contest shots – better than Sharpe
- Lateral quickness – better than Sharpe
- Pick and roll defense – better than Sharpe
- Shot-blocking skills – Sharpe is better
- Versatility to defend multiple positions – ditto
- Huge upside – ditto
- Positional versatility – ditto
- Court vision – Sharpe is better.
- Passing skills – ditto
- Body control – Sharpe is better
- Excellent first step – Sharpe is better.
- Explosiveness – Sharpe is better
- NBA body – ditto
- Size for position – Sharpe is bigger.
- Wingspan – unknown but appears close
- Offensive rebounding – Sharpe is better

Oh man, I’ve never seen Sharpe dunk on gumpy white dudes from Notre Dame.

Advantage Clark.

So if we cut Oberto we gain about 2M in cap space right? I’m guessing this extra money will go towards helping sign 2 quality FA’s instead of another 1st round pick? Having 19M in cap space instead of 17M could definitely make a difference in being able to get 2 quality guys. At the same time, I don’t feel like we’ve seen everything Amir can provide.

http://need4sheed.com/2008/11/walter-sharpes-first-nba-points-reverse-jam.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oT3wxFmJBI8

===
However if you want to see dunks then Dunkin Deron is the guy. 41-43" verticle leap

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYTg1TIAjZY

Need 4 Sheed just tweeted that we’re going to waive Oberto.

WTF? We just gave Amir away? #$!#$!@#$ He could have fetched something useful! Or maybe even been useful himself!!1

brgulker
Jun 23rd, 2009 at 9:48 pm

Need 4 Sheed just tweeted that we’re going to waive Oberto.

WTF? We just gave Amir away? #$!#$!@#$ He could have fetched something useful! Or maybe even been useful himself!!1

===
Dumars might have done it this way as a favor to Hammond, who we all know worked for Duamrs. Joe D. now holds one favor chip from Hammond.

Or the useful thing was cap space because Joe has a plan or a trade in the works or something. Hopefully.

It looks like amir is headed to the spurs: http://www.mlive.com/pistons/index.ssf/2009/06/amir_johnson_traded_to_san_ant.html

Two years of Richard Jefferson was just traded for essentially one year of Amir Johnson and one year of Kurt Thomas (assuming one year of aging Bowen is waived). I wouldn’t advocate RJ to Detroit at his price tag, but I would have to guess that he’s the first domino to fall in a summer where salary dumps can create big changes in the landscape. Maybe Joe has an offer(s) brewing.

So the Wizards now have the follwing 1/2/3’s…Arenas, Stevenson, N. Young, Butler, Miller and Foye. Plus, Jamsison can play a little SF. They have to trade one of those guys right?

So then, this:

Dumars might have done it this way as a favor to Hammond, who we all know worked for Duamrs. Joe D. now holds one favor chip from Hammond

Is terribly wrong. Come on, Mike, that’s the same kind of crap Petey would be around here trying to sell. You’re better than that (I hope).

Amir and Jefferson to the Spurs for role players? Would Rasheed set aside his ego and sign for the mid-level there? He is exactly what they need. And, Duncan and Pop will not tolerate his antics.

The article says: “The Pistons are putting the finishing touches on a three-way trade involving San Antonio and Milwaukee that will send Johnson, a former second-round pick by Detroit, to San Antonio and then on to Milwaukee”

I think that re-states what has already been stated that at the end of the day Amir has been traded to Milwaukee.

oh my bad. Didnt notice that part, only saw the “Pistons will send Johnson and cash to San Antonio in exchange for Fabricio Oberto”

wow…I think Amir being traded has to do with the fact Curry doesn’t know how to use him. Dumping for only 3 million in cap space and for a player we are going to end up cutting anyway? I don’t know.

Hopefully, Amir will blossom into a quality player for the Bucks.

OM – think of favor chips as deforming the defense. If you reinvent the league solely around the concept, you can apply it and never be wrong!

I only saw the same thing, too MG.

@Forty, hell yeah.

With the log-jam in Washington, anybody think that either Miller or Butler won’t be available? I’d love Miller as a 6th man and Butler as an offensive upgrade over Tay. Plus, Butler always seems to bring it against Cleveland.

I dont think butler will be moved since the wiz and all the rumors with the wiz say they want to keep him. If anything Nick Young or Deshawn Stevenson would be moved. Most likely Stevenson

i haven’t seen walter sharpe do dick. i saw more of earl clark play last year than walter sharpe. i only saw that dude on the bench. you guys get admittance to pistons practice or something? in his chat today, blakely made it sound like the guy could be on the way out this offseason if he doesn’t show something this summer.

@JackDutch:
Word to the wise, don’t listen to a damn thing Mike says. TRADE WESTCHESTER HIGH SCHOOL NOW.

JackDutch
Jun 23rd, 2009 at 10:48 pm

i haven’t seen walter sharpe do dick. i saw more of earl clark play last year than walter sharpe. i only saw that dude on the bench. you guys get admittance to pistons practice or something? in his chat today, blakely made it sound like the guy could be on the way out this offseason if he doesn’t show something this summer.
====
Blakely is the same guy who according to the quote on Need4Sheed said that the Pistons traded Johnson to the Spurs.

Sharpe didn’t play a lot in college but he played, he played very well.

The problem last season was that the Pistons tried to move him to SF and he struggled an awful lot with his defense there. It could be with Johnson gone and Washington arriving that the Pistons may move Sharpe back to his college position of PF where he showed he could both score in the paint and play solid defense and rebound.

Mike Payne
Jun 23rd, 2009 at 10:53 pm

@JackDutch:
Word to the wise, don’t listen to a damn thing Mike says. TRADE WESTCHESTER HIGH SCHOOL NOW.
===

Game Summary
California High School Basketball – Westchester fells McClymonds

(March 21, 2009: Oakland, CA 94607) Fans at Saturday’s non-league challenge between the Westchester Comets (Los Angeles, CA) and the host McClymonds Warriors (Oakland, CA), saw Westchester’s basketball squad overcome McClymonds by a count of 49-31.

With the victory, Westchester upgrades its record to 35-2 on the campaign.

http://www.maxpreps.com/high-schools/3_ml0seXq02cfZmSlRoTOw/westchester-comets/basketball/schedule.htm

Mike, you were like a goddamn parrot with those 73 Trade Amirs, but hey man, if you liked the kid, I’m sorry you have to see him go. Let’s kick back and look at Dumars’ scheme.

I do have to eat a little crow though. If this is the mark to market on Amir, holy crap. I’m still bullish, but yowza, someone with a lot more information than I have just sold 75% below what I thought was fair value. Gotta take it at face value on some level.

Skylar – since when did Mike want to trade Amir?

TRADE CAP SPACE NOW

Why does all this talk make me want beef jerky?

@MF Forty:
Skylar – since when did Mike want to trade Amir?

I lol’d my ass off!

@MF Skylar:
Mike, you were like a goddamn parrot with those 73 Trade Amirs

I’m glad I wasn’t the only one counting, brother fist bumps MF Skylar

@Mike:
Game Summary
California High School Basketball – Westchester fells McClymonds

Super cool story bro.

A man walks into a trading post in a small Alaskan village. He walks up to a seller and points to the foot of a rare Kodiak, after a bit of hushed negotiating, the man slices of his penis, and exchanges it for the foot just as another man is walking in to purchases supplies.

Aghast, the man inquires, “how can you do such a thing to your precious member?”

“What, that?” Replies the man, “that was a mere johnson… THIS is a bear toe.”

To put it another way, the Bucks traded a Dick, and got a Johnson.

@ Kevin S.

Applause

I agree with Mike on the Sharpe/Clark comparison. I’ve admittedly seen little of both, but Sharpe looks like a lottery talent and has better ball handling skills.

I disagree with Mike that Sharpe is a PF. He’s bigger than Amir but he’ll still get pushed around. My question is whether Sharpe can guard SFs on the perimeter and whether he can get his head in the game.

If the Pistons draft Clark, I guess we’ll know our answer to those questions. Although, I also question whether Clark can guard SFs on the perimeter because he’s going to get pushed around in the post too.

Here’s Keith Langlois, always ready to piss in Pistons fans collective shoes with his awful scenarios:
http://www.nba.com/pistons/news/truebluepistons.html

Take a guess… What player does Keith think this cap space clearing move might lead us too? It’s gonna knock everyones socks off, we’ll be right back in the title hunt, maybe the beginning of a dynasty.

Charlie Villanueva.

If this is all an elaborate plan to sign Charlie V, then, ummmmm, yeah, I’m just going to hope Keith Langlois doesn’t know what he’s talking about.

Gabe, I wouldn’t mind Villanueva in tandem with Boozer (and if CV can play legit minutes at SF too as Tay’s backup). He gives a different look. As a starter, not so much.

Oh god, if Charlie V is our biggest front court addition…. Dumars job will be on the line soon.

Gabe, Occam’s Razor says that Langlois is probably wrong. He uses some very complicated reasoning.

My guess is that Dumars thought about selling off Amir Johnson and the 15th pick to OKC (as rumored) for more cap space. He probably saw someone he liked in the draft and decided to keep the pick. OKC probably wanted the pick more than Amir so he had to find another way to sell him off and the Oberto thing worked out.

It’s about cap space in general, not cap space to get Villanueva necessarily.

@QD:
Unless you’re giving Villanueva consistent, starter quality minutes, he’s shit. His 08-09 season was pretty solid on the offensive end, but he performed best as a starter or a super 6, and if you’ve got Boozer at the 4 that ain’t happening out of C-Villa.

The only way Villanueva works is with starter minutes— otherwise he’s garbage. Even if you give him 28/game split between the 3 and the 4, the split roles will kill his production.

If we ever wound up with Villanueva on our squad, I’d do these two things:
1) Pray to the Kander god that he can keep Villa in check.
2) Hope that we start him at the 3. We start Villanueva at the 4 without an all-star 5, hello lottery.

…but if Villanueva can stay consistent and healthy, I’d love love love the guy as our 3. Granted he’s oversized, but shit, the guy is a 3 100%.

QD:

I hope I didn’t make it sound like I hate Villanueva. I think he’s a pretty good player, though like you, I don’t think of him as a starter, but he can be a solid piece of a rotation.

I just found the idea of Joe D plotting out a series of moves with the ultimate goal of signing Charlie Villanueva funny.

Villanueva is not the answer. Also, how can anyone say that Walter Sharpe is a lottery talent? What have we seen from him? This what I have seen from Earl Clark — 24 points on 10-15 shooting, 10 boards, 7 assists in the Big East Championship. That is proven talent.

In the scenario Langlois supposes, we invest $6.5 million/year in Villanueva. That’s not really putting too many eggs in one basket. I think that’s a great value for Villanueva and still leaves us with a boatload of cap space. I don’t believe we could get @CV31 for that cheap though.

Wow, the D trades AHMEER, SON OF JOHN and DBB lights up like the freakin’ sun. Does this mean we can’t buy Free Amir shirts any more?

all i’m saying is i don’t know how anyone could compile a 60 point list on the merits of walter sharpe. dude took 11 shots TOTAL last year. no one watched him in college. when he was drafted, everyone on this board responded “who the f is walter sharpe?” then we found out he was an undiagnosed narcoleptic, but was now a medicated narcoleptic, which would make all the difference in him becoming an incredible sleeper pick, stolen deftly in the 2nd round. have the events of today not taught us anything?

wake me up when walter sharpe scores double digits in a season.

This was stupid. That’s all I’ve got to say on the subject.

Espn’s Chad Ford on the trade:

“That could put them roughly $23 million under the cap going into free agency. Over the past few months we’ve assumed that Carlos Boozer was their primary target, but that may not be the case. A league source told me on Tuesday that the Pistons’ free agent strategy would likely preclude a run at Boozer.

The Pistons want to add several players to the roster and want to keep salaries at or below $10 million per year. With Boozer likely demanding a deal in the $15 to $16 million a year range, his contract demands are out of their league. Add in concerns about Boozer’s injury history and I don’t think the Pistons make a play for him."

Tonight I feel like my last name is boozer.

Chad Ford’s “league source” is almost certainly Dumars himself.

Why do I have this feeling they’re going to make a run at Artest? The problem is, like Rodman, the only guy who could probably coach him, died a few weeks ago.

As for trading Amir…maybe Hammonds sees something in him that his ex-boss missed. Or maybe he’s seeing it as, well, MC and his staff can’t develop anyone worth shit, maybe we can…

This sucks. Oberto sucks.

Wow. Go to dinner with Corp and the whole team gets blown up. It’s too bad we didn’t get to see what Amir could do with consistent minutes other than foul out. He’s seems like a good kid. Good luck to him.

Well, I think this is the first step in a big move. You don’t just trade for 166K or 2M in cap space just to then say to yourself, well, lets see what’s out there. I prefer to wait and see what happens after Jul-1. However, my fear is that BG really does have a promise for 11M.

screw lebron, lets sign Amir next offseason after we let the bucks develop him a little

Same here MBinSC – except strike “dinner with Corp” with “get drunk at a concert.”

On the bright side, at least we got a pick out of it. Right, we got a pick at least? We didn’t just give away another player that has value for nothing, right? Even a future pick? We didn’t yield more for Carlos Delfino than for Amir, right?

Trading Amir? Trade proposals for Stuckey/Rip/Tay? Next thing you’re gonna tell me we dealt Chauncey!

If blatche can take another step this year, and Agent 0 is back, the wiz might be one of my favorite teams to watch this year. starting 5:
1 – Gil
2 – Foye
3 – Butler
4 – Jamison
5 – Haywood
And then you bring young, miller and blatche off the bench. Flip knows how to run an offense. Not sure why Minny is loading up on picks in a weak draft, either. Barring injury, I think you can pencil the Wiz back into the playoffs this year.

“It’s too bad we didn’t get to see what Amir could do with consistent minutes other than foul out. "

Actually, we did. During one seven game stretch, Amir averaged 25.7 mpg, 6 ppg, 7.2 rpg, and 1.7 bpg, and he was +31.

The Pistons went 6-1, holding opponents to 83.6 ppg, and outrebounding them by an average of 6.3 rpg.

Incidentally, for those saying Oberto is a solid C, what are you basing this on? He was worse than Kwame last year.

@Forty – At least we’ve still got Sheed and Ben…

@ Shinons: Who’s concert? Sounds alot better than mine.

“Incidentally, for those saying Oberto is a solid C, what are you basing this on?”

Starting on a team that won the championship in 2007.

He’s physically very limited but he’s smart and always seems to be in the right place.

Walter Sharpe played Center in college. I do think he could play the 4 in the NBA though, he just needs a little more beef and work on his defense.

As for the favor chip, that’s what this could possibly be. With the trade the Bucks did with SA, they will now be able to re-sign one of their big free agents(most likely Sessions). They weren’t going to go into luxury tax territory to re-sign Villanueva so Joe saw an opportunity to give Amir a better chance and perhaps a “promise” from Hammond that he won’t match on an offer for Villanueva since he will be getting a cheaper Amir. Charlie V won’t be signing a deal worth what Amir’s contract is worth so Hammond is still able to keep a good, young PF at a much cheaper price. Plus, you know Hammond likes him because he was with the organization when we drafted him AND when we signed him to an extension.

This is all just speculation but it could very well be what’s going on behind closed doors.

MBinSC – The Queers. Small venue, cheap beer, lots of punk rock. A good night.

What’s the right swear word(s) for this? Fromo Stein @ ESPN

Strong indications persist that the Pistons will go ahead with their expected hard push for Chicago Bulls free agent-to-be Ben Gordon starting July 1, even though Rip Hamilton’s contract extension hasn’t even kicked in yet.

So you also can expect to keep hearing Hamilton’s name surfacing in trade proposals, in spite of all his history in Detroit, because the Pistons can’t possibly find a way to make room for Gordon, Hamilton and Rodney Stuckey. And then you have to consider the rumblings on our radar about how Rip and Pistons coach Michael Curry are not exactly sharing the same worldview.

Hire BL NOW!!

Shinons: Sounds like it.

plus, at $7 mil per, I would much rather have Charlie V than a injury-riddled Boozer starting at $12 mil+ per.

We need to fire Michael Curry. Seriously. I can’t even think about the future of the Stones while he is coach.

Well, if Cowens walked I think we should see Bill L enter the picture as an assistant.

I don’t know what’s not to like about Charlie Villanueva? The guy has come from a proven winner, having won an NCAA championship with UCONN. He is only 24 years old, and he is a legit 6’11", 230 frame at the 4 spot. Last year he averaged 16 and 7, and that was with him playing LESS than 27 mpg. He has never averaged 30 mpg so his legs are even a little fresher than a normal 4 year starter. He has put up solid numbers every year he has played, so he is not a flash in the pan(13 and 6, 12 and 6, 12 and 6, and finally 16 and 7). I don’t know if we even have to pay him $7 mil per. I don’t think Milwaukee will match an offer and I don’t think any other teams will offer him a deal. I think we could get him for $6 mil per or maybe even $5 mil per to start. I like the guy and I have been talking about him for a while. I, for one, hope we get him because then that would mean that we don’t overpay for Boozer. Even if we did sign him for $7 mil, we would still have AT LEAST $12 mil to spend. I like that.

hey QD, this just in…

2007 was 2 years ago

Fabricio Oberto played 2 games in the playoffs THIS year.

If 5ppg and 5rpg are acceptable numbers for our starting center’s high water marks for his career, then Oberto is the fucking man.

Otherwise, he’s just another dirty spaniard who looks like he’d rather be homeless with the way he keeps himself groomed than be a professional athlete. 5 and 5.. wow, our most important offseason in a long time has started off with a bang.

Unless we’re offering $9m per year to Charlie V, Milwaukee will re-sign him. Plus, I don’t think Joe D fucks with Hammond like that.

Villenueva is everything we hated about Rasheed Wallace and half you assclowns want him in the Piston red blue and white? Get a hold of yourselves you guys, Villenueva is not the answer.

Shit, I’d rather put Lamar Odom in the post before I’d put Chucky V down there… and you know how I feel about Lamar.

Mark butter, I read that ESPN blurb too and just kept thinking how the hell Rip is more expendable than Curry, that sentiment is packed full of what the fuck.

I like the ‘sign 3 FAs at $7-8M’ strategy better than the ‘sign 2 FAs at $11-12M’ strategy. The Pistons have plenty of minutes to hand out so more players will work great. And if things aren’t panning out with the Deeptroit Basketball plan, package 2 of the $7-11M players for a superstar down the road.

Can you get Gortat, Villenueva and Ariza in one offseason for $23M and do any resigning you have to do (McDyess?)? That might give you 4 players who average 14-19 points a game (Stuckey, Rip, Tay, Villenueva), size, youth, rebounding, the #15 pick and MFWB. It would be more fun rooting for that team than last year’s model.

@Boney:
Villenueva is everything we hated about Rasheed Wallace and half you assclowns want him in the Piston red blue and white?

Agreed. 64% of Villanueva’s shots were jumpers outside the paint, upon which 73% were assisted.

I don’t want that shit out our PF. Compare that to Carlos Boozer, who takes half of his shots from inside the paint (and converted at 66% in his last full season, as opposed to 53% out of villanueva).

Charlie Villanueva is a perimeter player— I’d love him as our SF. As our PF, hell to the no.

@Mike Payne

Umm, Villenueva at the 3?

I trust Jason Maxiell to keep LeBron and Paul Pierce in front of him more than I would trust Villenueva to.

Villenueva at the 3 = fail.

Rondo – PG
Ray – SG
Ariza – SF
Millsap – PF
Gortat – C

DIZ TEEM BILL BIN DA CHAMPEUNCHIPS!

@joejoejoe:
Can you get Gortat, Villenueva and Ariza in one offseason for $23M and do any resigning you have to do (McDyess?)? That might give you 4 players who average 14-19 points a game (Stuckey, Rip, Tay, Villenueva), size, youth, rebounding, the #15 pick and MFWB.

I wouldn’t say “size”, “height” is a bit more accurate. Gortat, Villanueva and Ariza are all tall, but very underweight. Example:

That front line weighs a combined 682, whereas the Celtics front line weighs 768. They have a 20+ pound upgrade at every position, SF to Center. For a guy like Villanueva to really work, he, like Rasheed, needs a stud C next to him. Since there is no Big Ben to Villanueva’s game available at present, that squad would have a tough time defending bigger teams.

The Celtics are a unique example though, as they’ve got one of the bigger frontcourts in the L. Still, I’d be worried about that group getting pushed around…

@Boney:
Umm, Villenueva at the 3?

I trust Jason Maxiell to keep LeBron and Paul Pierce in front of him more than I would trust Villenueva to.

You mean just like Tayshaun Prince and almost every other 3 in the league can’t do? The difference is that if Villanueva could at least be serviceable on D (and he has size, speed and weight to throw at a guy like Lebron)— he can at least score (and score well) on the other end.

Shinons: The Queers deliver every time I see them. It might be a 45 minute set from the headliners, but WHAT a 45 minute set!

Looks like Boney is one of those “assclowns” that wanted Detroit to trade its whole core for a slightly better PG and an over-the-hil SG.

lol

Ariza won’t leave LA and Millsap prolly won’t leave Utah. Gortat would be nice to have but I would want him with our current team, not with the one you proposed.

We are all playing “gm” here, so respect other people’s opinions and they will respect yours.

Speaking of the laughable trade, I think I got blocked from Pistonpost.com for arguing with the guy about the trade. He, like Boney, liked the trade and thought we should have done it. I refuted it last night and now this morning when I seen his reply, I tried to respond and it wouldn’t let me. It said I either posted too fast or I tried to send a duplicate!

LOL

Boney, does it really matter? The Pistons are going to cut him anyway. Not sure why people are so up in arms about this move. Wasn’t this expected all along?

I would have rather kept Amir to trade for a player instead of cap space but I’m assuming Dumars has a sense of what he can get now.

However, Millsap DOES leave Utah if Boozer starts to get cold feet thinking he won’t get the deal he wants and decides not to opt out, because then Utah wouldn’t have the money to sign Millsap. So then we could have him, and I definitely would not mind having him because he’s a cheaper version of Boozer.

As for Villanueva, I doubt he can play defense at either forward position.

Agreed QD. I can’t wait until the week of July 1st.

I’m not sure about Charlie’s D, I didn’t get to see too many Milwaukee games except for the ones he played against the Pistons. He did serviceable from what I saw. I just know the guy can put up some monster games and can single-handedly win a couple games for us. I like that in a player. Defense can be taught, it’s a mind-set.

NBARoundTable’s take on the Amir trade:

http://nbaroundtable.wordpress.com/2009/06/24/trade-oberto-for-amir-johnson/

KronikJ: Def can’t be taught. Systems, sure. The “will” – nope.

I beg to differ markbutters. When we drafted Lindsey Hunter, he was regarded as a score-first PG. A SG in a PG’s body so to speak. He was never thought of as a defensive presence, but low and behold, he turned out to be a great defender. One of the better on the ball defenders to suit up for the Pistons. The same can be said for RIP, he was once considered a defensive liability, but now people view him as a solid defender. Who’s to say the same can’t happen for Villanueva? He’s certainly athletic enough to play defense and stay in front of the opposing team’s PF. I just think if his defense is the only knock we have against him, there could be far worse things.

Astonishing, if true, that Boozer thinks he can pull $15-16M a season. For 50 games a year and not a shred of defense in those 50? Dude is flat-out crazy. I’ll be so glad if his craziness keeps him out of Detroit. That’s the one silver lining for me in these latest depressing reports about Amir and Gordon and other nonsense.

KronJ: I think it’s one more of those exceptions to the rule. And I think he also changed his game to become that D specialist. How many guys in the NBA are willing to do that. The guys is almost 40 and still playing, largely because of D and he’s had to have made a decent amount of coin during that time. That means he’s playing alot of heart and how many players get to that point of say mid-30’s and are willing to keep their body in shape and do the off-season stuff to go out there and play D for 10-15 minutes a game at a vet min of ~1M? Not very many.

And that’s where D comes from. . . the heart.

Bill H: Agree. Even 14M is too much. I went to school in S. Utah and don’t remember drinking any kind of water that would lead someone to think that.

Saw J. Crawford to Atl for Claxton & Law. Sorry Monta, said we wouldn’t draft a PG, not trade for one. On the bright side, dreaming of J. Johnson in Det. Takning on Jamal’s contract is alot if he’s playing behind JJ. Bye – Bye Mr. Bibby. Or at least you’re now going to get far less money.

The Celtics front line weighs 768.

How much of that is Kendrick Perkins’ butt?

The dominoes are falling. So, now, that’s 2 eastern teams picking up talent in the last 2 days. I heard chad ford’s/simmons pod cast, and they were asking out loud who wanted chris kamen. With only 7 players currently on the roster (for sure) next season, it’s going to be an interesting couple days here coming up.

btw, Kronik, boney was being sarcastic upthread.

why don’t we go after iguodala? philly doesn’t know how to remedy the fact that their two best players (iggy and thad young) are both small forwards. they tried iggy at 2, but that failed cause he doesn’t have a consistent jumper. they play thad at 4, but that’s going to be an issue once brand is back. you get the feeling too that they’re unsure iggy is worth the 80mill they just paid him.

rip is a philly kid. and the sixers desperately need a sg. send him home like chauncey. also philly’s supposedly looking for a 2nd rounder. we have 3 of those. it seems more and more likely that gordon is coming, like it or not. that probably means rip has to go. as far as tay, i wouldn’t mind keeping him. maybe the secret with tay is playing him less minutes. a 6th man role might be ideal.

KRONIKjose?

Get bent.

Ray Allen and his contract give the Pistons a better option than the overpaid Tayshaun and Richard Hamilton’s contracts do. Do I want the trade to be made? Not particularly, but I wouldn’t be suicidal if it happened.

JackDutch,

Iggy would be ok in a Piston uniform. Tay is too expensive to come off the bench.

@JD

I really like that idea actually.

Stuck/MFWB
Gordon/AA
Iggy/Prince

What we do about the bigs, especially if we’re overpaying Gordon to the tune of $11mil, I have no idea. But I do like that backcourt. A lot actually. Six-deep with studs. Actually the more I look at it as I type it, the more I like it still.

Rip + second-rounder for Iggy? I’m down. It fills a need for both teams.

I don’t think Tay’s too expensive to be coming off the bench. He’d be in that “super-sub” role (Odom/Barbosa/Ginobli), where he plays like 30 mpg splitting time between the 3 and 4 depending who’s out there. His “point forward” abilities (overrated as they are) make him the perfect candidate for this type of role.

Prince at the 4? DO NOT WANT.

well, i didn’t want to say it, because i think some people would throw up, but the sixers are beyond desperate to move dalembert’s deal, which is one of the worst in the league. if you were to offer to take him on you could have just about anyone you wanted on that team. (except maybe thad young.) if we’re looking to get more athletic on the defensive end, you could do a lot worse. that kid will never play to that contract, but i think he is a salvageable project.

although i guess you have to consider that curry is doing the salvaging….

Dalembert > Tyson Chandler

@Shinons:
Agreed 100%

@Jack Dutch:
I’d take it on if we had to… it’d be tough to carry both Dalembert AND Iguodala’s contracts, but it might be possible for tay, rip and maxiell. that’s more than I’d be comfortable moving though… we’d get back a lot less than we’d give in that case.

Oh, and i’d rather make a move for Dalembert than Kaman in a heartbeat.

MP, I figured that would be a Tyson Chandler mention that you would approve of.

I just don’t think I’m going to follow next season..

MC coaching Stuckey, out of position, at the 1 with Gordon at the 2, tay at the 3, whatever we get for rip at the 4 and Charlie V at the 5?

Yeah we have the cap space for a couple big FA signings but I don’t foresee that money being used effectively.

get into a time machine and go back to 2008, put AI in at the 1 and sit stuckey on the bench where he belongs.
Fire MC.
Hire BL.
Trade Tay-Chandler
trade next to nothing for tmac

AI
Rip
Tmac
Sheed
Chandler

..With a capable, respectable coach in command AI and Sheed would be sure to stay on a championship-calibre team at a reduced rate.. even if they didn’t, wed have the cap space to resign them..

Its jsut that easy.. Now who has a time machine?

@Chad:
hahahahahaha

i think you could really take advantage of the sixers here. they are hard up to deal dalembert. and dalembert is a solid center in the nba. extremely overpaid, but solid. his defensive ability alone is why the sixers pushed the magic to 6. because he could guard howard one on one and allow the sixers perimeter guys to stay at home. i think they’d give up either speights or jason smith to move dalembert. either one of those guys has major potential, especially speights.

If they’d move speights… I’d salivate like mad. Kid is unreal.

@ QD:

He was a favorite of the people who like to live on Potential Mountain.

I am laughing from Pragmatist Valley, watching the ash cloud from this eruption grow closer, preparing to set sail on the SS No Fault of Mine, for which I’ll get far enough away from the blast radius before I sit down to repair one of the sails with my Free Amir t-shirt.

Ok fellas, I need to play a little scroog here. Hey Matt W. what’s up brother. I used to be addicted to DBB then got turned off around the first half of last season when guys constantly trashed each other and the sky was always falliing. I tuned back in this off season cause we are major players. Two things 1) Stop talking about the Amir trade. I know this is America and you have the right. But guys, it was a salary move and Oberto is getting cut. Please chill out. 2)I can’t believe this Iggy convo has gone on this long. He’s their best player and they don’t have a log jam at SF. They moved Iggy to SG this year and he had a wonderful year for them. We throw out trades that either are not possible or isn’t in the best interest of the other team and we’ll spend 1/2 a day talking about it. Iggy aint leaving Philly. Period. Let’s talk about something else. Now if your thinking “well don’t read our comments then”. The problem with that is I love DBB and have always enjoyed highly substantive dialogue here, but unfortunately sometimes it becomes the equivalent of Fantasy Baseball, not the wonderful content I’m used to with real trade, FA or draft scenarios. All that being said……Go Pistons!!!!!

e-doub, sorry, you’re wrong. they put iggy at 2 when brand was there and he stumbled out of the gate big time. once brand was injured, iggy moved back to the 3 and thad young slid to 4, which was the uptempo lineup from the previous season that the players flourished in. if iggy was a legit 2, they wouldn’t have started willie friggin’ green 60 games this season. iguodala is an 80 million dollar shooting guard that can’t shoot. before the deal and after the deal, people questioned loudly if he was worth that much dough. now, stefanski has a .500 team with a lot of money already on the table. he can either cross his fingers and hope everything works out (possible), or he can feel the pressure to keep tweaking the roster. if you think he doesn’t feel the pressure, you don’t know philly. favorite son or not (and that hasn’t mattered with jim o’brien or mo cheeks most recently before him), the city and owner only want a winner. if stefanski doesn’t win now, he’s going to be out of a job fast. if you can’t see how that would motivate the sixers to listen to offers from all comers about all players, you’re wrong again.

and i take offense that of ALL the asinine trades that come up on dbb, this is the one that suddenly gets your tirade a rollin’. you’re right, it’s been a bitchy year on dbb. i’ve largely tuned out myself. but what do you expect to find right now? it’s the offseason, on the day before one of the most unpredictable drafts i can remember. rolling your eyes and poo-pooing it is more annoying than 10 guys suggesting we trade maxiell and a box of AAs for lebron james.

go pistons.

Jack D: +1

I’ll take Kaman or Chandler before Dalembert. The guy has no offensive game (or perhaps because of the other players around him and I admit I haven’t been interested in the sixers since Dr J.).

So we’re athletic on D, but have to play 4 on 5 on the other end. At least Chandler has a better B-ball IQ. Not sure how long Dalembert contract runs, but at worst we’d have Chandler off the books after 10/11 if he didn’t opt out next year (and he won’t).

Kaman: 15/10/2. For a 7 footer that play acceptable defense making 11M a year. I’d take it in a heartbeat. At worst 12/8/1. Still take it.

And what’s up in Boston? Talk about imploding. Ainge goes out and says basically Rondo cost them the Orl series? And this is the way you get max value for a guy you’re trying to trade?

Danny Ainge commented that Rajon Rondo has “got to grow up,” and “his presence hurt us” against Orlando in the Eastern Conference semifinals and that Rondo wasn’t a “max contract player”
and acknowledged Rondo was fined for being tardy to postseason games.

Giiven how woefull the Celts were prior to last year for the 2-3 years Ainge was GM and the gifts of KG and deal of Ray Allen from Sonics were on draft day, if I’m a boston fan and have to rely on Ainge “rebuilding” the Celts I’m a bit worried. However, you gotta believe this is KG talking thru Ainge. Me thinks RR’s head has gotten too big for his neck to hold up.

I just thought this was funny – in a cruel sarcastic way.

Tom Powers of the Pioneer Press: "All I know is that if Kevin McHale had the No. 5 and the No. 6 picks in the NBA draft tonight, he would wind up making a trade with himself and, somehow, getting screwed. But the Timberwolves have new leadership, and so there is a strong chance this draft could be a tragedy-free experience. It certainly will be interesting, and not in the usual catastrophic way.

@ Shinons

AI don’t need to be anywhere near a Pistons jersey, wheather they fire Curry or not!!!!! The AI idea is a bust, I don’t know about Curry but it will definitly get Joe Dumar fire!!!!

Well look at you JackDutch, I guess I stand corrected now don’t I. :-) 2 points for you my brother. I bet you a cold beer Iggy doesn’t get moved though. Even with the corrections you made to my comments. But I don’t take back my other comment. Amir’s gone, Oberto is getting cut. Talk about somethin else Ami apologist. Not accusing you of being one JD.

@JackDutch:
I’ll take Kaman or Chandler before Dalembert.

I respect the point and understand the offense concerns about Dalembert. I’d counter with a few things which make Dalembert a much better option:

1) Injuries! Number of games played in the last three seasons:
- Chris Kaman: 162
- Tyson Chandler: 197
- Samuel Dalembert: 246 (that’s 246 straight, hasn’t missed a game in three seasons)

Tyson Chandler’s injury issues have just begun. At first, his foot ended up voiding a trade. Then he had surgery, and he was supposed to be back at 100% a month ago. He’s still in bad shape, with no real light at the end of the tunnel. As for Kaman, his last three seasons speak for themselves. Dalembert has played a FULL SEASON more than Kaman in the last three years, and 49 games more than Chandler.

2) Contracts.
- Chris Kaman: $43.4 million through 2012
- Tyson Chandler: $35.5 million through 2011
- Samuel Dalembert: $34.9 million through 2011

3) Performance.
Yep, Dalembert is a hole on O, save for putbacks, alley-oops and tips. But he is a MUCH, MUCH better rebounder and a MUCH better shotblocker than either. He grabs almost 3 more boards per game than either Kaman or Chandler. And for what it’s worth, Chandler presents zero offensive upside over Dalembert. Here’s a comparison:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/fc/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=dalemsa01&y1=2009&p2=kamanch01&y2=2009&p3=chandty01&y3=2009

So we could have an 82 game/year C that can rebound and block shots lights out, a perfect tall/big complement to a 20ppg PF like Boozer— and without eating into our cap. I don’t care what Kander sacrifices to the god of the kneecap, Chris Kaman and Tyson Chandler will never get us anywhere near 82 games a year. Roll the dice on when those injuries happen, and pray they don’t come during the playoffs…

Maybe it’s a west coast bias thing, but I take Kaman over all the other C’s too.

In Kaman’s defense, in his last (relatively) healthy season, two years ago, as the Clips’ go to post guy, he averaged close to 16ppg, 13rpg, and 3bpg, and this is actual game numbers, not projected per-36 numbers.

I think that a healthy (HEALTHY) Kaman is without a doubt the better of all those guys. It’s just whether or not he can stay healthy. But I take a healthy Kaman over ever center in the league not named Dwight, Pao, Yao, and maybe Oden. The operational word here is “H-E-A-L-T-H-Y”. So I guess it’s a moot point.

That being said, he’s easily at least a 15/11/2 guy in 35 mpg for the Pistons, albeit for 30-50 games a season (sad trombone).

Dalembert has always struck me as mentally retarded for some reason. Just never liked him. If we had a really good offensive 4 though, like say West, Boozer, etc., he could be perfect.

@QD

jumping high-five

@Joel:
Totally agreed. If we knew we were going to get 82/season out of him for the next three, he’s THE best option. Sadly, I don’t even think we’d get 70.

Dalembert has always struck me as mentally retarded for some reason. Just never liked him.

Me too, I can’t stand the dude. That faux hawk sealed it last year. But yeah, next to a 20ppg PF who might have defensive liabilities, he’s the “safest” option without giving up defensive/rebounding productivity.

@MP

jumping high-five with freeze frame at apex

I always liked… kowabunga.

Rondo’s attitude fits in perfect with the Celts, they are the most narcissistic squad in the league, they rep their fanbase quite well in that regard. On Danny Ainge, the dummy snookered the Wolves and Sonics, but the Celts are not going to contend for their 18th title for years to come.

@ MP: I think that was me taking Kaman. And yeah, if we had boozer we would definitely need someone of Dalambert’s positives (reb & shot blk) but with boozer looking for ~15M/yr, that ain’t going to happen. So we need more than just a def presence at the 5, given how much money we’re talking.

And given that the reason Kaman is being moved is because of a log jam and Delambert for ?, and some cap room for philly, why would they want to move him? If he would fit in so well with Boozer, is that not the same as Brand? Good low post moves, decent 15 footer and Brand plays better D than Boozer ( or at least effort). If he’s a good fit with Boozer, he’s a better fit with Brand. And if that’s true, let’s target Brand. He can be the face of a franchise, boozer not so much.

As for Kaman’s numbers, I think part of the points have to be taken in context because that’s when Brand tore his achilles, so he was a higher option on O.

As for retarded, I think Kaman will give it every nite, Dalembert not so much. Take the minimum 10-15 games a season Dalembert takes off and we’re not to far from ~65 games a season and closer to Kaman’s “availability to play.”

On a different note am I the only one wondering if the Piston are going to get in on any of these trades I wasn’t all that thrilled about the Boston offer but i expected more action then the Amir trade so far I’m hoping for some type big trade tonight and I don’t want Joe to grab the first trade thats half way in our favor just to say he’s doing something but I’m hoping for something big on another note how does the Atlanta trade affect Marvin is it gonna be harder to keep him ,he’d be a nice pickup for the Pistons.

I’m assuming that Joe is waiting for 1-Jul and FA’s or trades. I’m surprised at some of the trades in that, as C. Ford says this is the first draft that has guys ranges all over the place. Usually he can peg them within 5 picks, this year there or ranges of 5-15.

As for not trading the 15th pick: He’ either got 3-4 guys who he feels that at least one will definitely be there and/or, when the 15th pick comes up and he’s on record of saying he ain’t trading it some team may offer more than they were willing to before.

As for Williams, paying Crawford that much has to do something to the chances, even though the salaries within 25%, I believe they have to be according to the rules. But it may hurt them in that Crawford isn’t opting out next year and Claxton/Law expire this year. So everything else being equal, it has to impact somehow I would think.

As for retarded, I think Kaman will give it every nite, Dalembert not so much. Take the minimum 10-15 games a season Dalembert takes off and we’re not to far from ~65 games a season and closer to Kaman’s "availability to play."

To Dalembert’s defense, his minutes get yanked around like a yo-yo, sometimes for good reason (foul trouble), most times not. I thought that, after Mo Cheeks left, things would change, but Philly seems to have their mind made up about Sam. That could be a knock on him, but Orlando also had their mind made up about Ben. (the two don’t compare at all, but point being that Dalembert has shown promise, in spite of a system’s preference not to use him properly)

I agree re: Boozer. If Boozer gets $15M/season, I will point and laugh at whoever is dumb enough to pay it. Even if it is Dumars. Fucker needs to realize he can get LENGTH of contract, which we CAN offer, and we’d be taking a risk because of his injuries.

(I almost capitalized “injuries”, but realized I’d be biting coachDP)