Options for Rebuilding the Franchise: Why Salary Dumps Won't Work
by brgulker on Jan 7, 2010 2:47 AM EST
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PrintEd. note: Added to the front page because it's informative and nobody wants to talk about an 11-game losing streak right now. -- Packey
Preface
The salary cap is an incredibly complex topic. I’m not an expert. All of my numbers should be taken as rough approximations but should be accurate enough to give our discussions of future Piston acquisitions a realistic context. If you notice any omissions and/or errors, please feel free to offer a correction or addition. Also, I’ve linked to the sources I used if you’re interested.
Since the trade last season, we’ve all speculated on what the next moves for Joe Dumars and the Pistons should be. To give this larger conversation some context, I thought it would be helpful to examine three things (not in order of how they appear in the post): One: how much money the Pistons already have committed in player salary for 2010-201. Two: how the salary cap and luxury tax impact Dumars’ options for this season, this summer, and the 2010-2011 season. Three: the strengths and weaknesses of three potential scenarios for future acquisitions.
A Shrinking Salary Cap
Let’s start with the shrinking salary cap. This summer, the NBA notified teams that the salary cap is estimated to drop to somewhere between $50.4 million and $53.6 million. Correspondingly, the luxury tax line will fall somewhere between $61 and $63 million.
Who's on the books?
With that in mind, let’s have a look at what the Pistons will have on the books for the 2010-2011 season given their current contracts:
Richard Hamilton $12,500,000
Tayshaun Prince $11,147,760
Ben Gordon $10,800,000*
Charlie Villanueva $7,020,000
Jason Maxiel $5,000,000
Rodney Stuckey $2,767,126
Austin Daye $1,803,720
Chris Wilcox $3,000,000 (player option)**
DaJuan Summers $762,195 (not fully guaranteed)**
Jonas Jerebko $762,195 (not fully guaranteed)**
Total: $55,562,996
In addition to those commitments, the Pistons will need to decide how to handle these three players, whose 2009-2010 contracts are shown:
Kwame Brown $4,000,000
Will Bynum $825,497
Ben Wallace $825,497 (actual) | $1,306,455 (figure that counts toward luxury tax)
We know that Joe Dumars wants to retain Will Bynum, and we know that he’s no longer a secret around the league. It’s going to take more than this year’s salary to retain him, but it’s difficult to estimate exactly how much. For the sake of conversation, let’s say $2,000,000 (it could very well be higher). Also for the sake of conversation, let’s say that Joe lets Kwame walk (although I don’t think that’s a certainty). And finally, let’s say Ben Wallace is retained on a minimum contract, which doesn’t impact how much FA money we can spend but does get included when considering the luxury tax.
That leaves us with two important numbers. First and more importantly, $58,869,451 in salary will count toward the luxury tax. This figure is vital, because Dumars will not want to exceed the luxury tax threshold. Second, $57,562,996 which is the salary that will count toward the salary cap after Big Ben’s minimum contract is deducted. That salary would be committed to the following 12 players:
Richard Hamilton
Tayshaun Prince
Ben Gordon
Charlie Villanueva
Jason Maxiel
Rodney Stuckey
Austin Daye
Chris Wilcox
DaJuan Summers
Jonas Jerebko
Will Bynum
Ben Wallace
For the sake of conversation, let’s assume a $52 million salary cap and a $62 million dollar luxury tax threshold for 2010-2011. Obviously, we will be well over the cap at $57,562,996 and dangerously close to the luxury tax at $58,869,451. Being over the cap allows us to use the Mid-Level Exception, which was $5.854 million last summer. We will also have the Bi-Annual Exception at our disposal, which will be $2.08 million in 2010-2011. However, those two exceptions cannot be combined and offered to the same player.
What Are the Options?
With that in mind, let's examine three potential scenarios that Piston fans have suggested. 1) Salary dump: trade some of our big contracts for large expiring contracts and use all that cap space to rebuild. 2) Trade our assets for other assets. 2b) Trade assets for assets and spend the MLE + Bi-Annual this summer. 3) Don’t trade anyone and spend the MLE + Bi-Annual this summer.
Here are the pros and cons, as I see them, to each of these scenarios.
Option 1) Let’s take Tracy McGrady as an example of a big expiring contract, and let’s use Rip and Tay as the pieces to complete that deal, as has been proposed here and elsewhere around the interwebs. McGrady’s salary is $22,483,124 for 2009-2010. Assuming we renounce our rights to him immediately after the season (which we would have to do to avoid an absurd cap hold), we would be left with $35,079,872 in committed salaries; however, we would be left with only 9 players and several cap holds for those open roster spots (cap holds are incredibly confusing, so I’m going to ignore specifics and give a rough estimate). Conservatively, I’ll estimate $5 million for those open slots and our first round pick’s cap holds. That leaves us with approximately $40,079,972 in committed salaries for 2010-2011 to the following players:
Ben Gordon
Charlie Villanueva
Jason Maxiel
Rodney Stuckey
Austin Daye
Chris Wilcox
DaJuan Summers
Jonas Jerebko
Will Bynum
Ben Wallace
And just under $12 million to replace Rip and Tay and find a big man (as well as positions 12-14 on the roster, probably draft picks or minimum contracts). That’s a tall order. Also, I think Houston values the cap space McGrady’s expiring deal will create for them, and I suspect his contract isn't available.
Option 3) If we don’t trade anyone, we will have the MLE and Bi-Annual at our disposal, which total just under $8 million. In this scenario, we don’t lose Rip and Tay, and we have only $4 million less in available money than a trade for McGrady would acquire.
However, there is a significant problem: the luxury tax threshold. Given the numbers we’re assuming for conversation, there is only $3,130,549 to spend before we have to pay the luxury tax (for every $1 a team goes over the tax, the team pays $1 to the league). That’s not a lot of wiggle room, and we simply cannot sign the players we need with $3 million dollars.
Option 1 has significant problems: it leaves us with approximately $11.8 million, which isn’t enough to replace the players we need, at least not immediately. It’s further problematized by the fact that everyone in the NBA values large expiring deals right now – there’s a very good reasons for teams to retain such deals or trade them assets more valuable than Rip + Tay.
Option 2 leaves us with approximately $8 million in available money and retains our talent, but is potentially crippled by the luxury tax payments that would have to be paid if we spend all the money that is available to us.
That leaves us with Option(s) 2(b). In my opinion, this is our only option. We have to find a way to trade our assets for other assets. But it has to be done very creatively so that we can utilize our available exceptions this summer and avoid the luxury tax. We have to trade talent for talent, shed a little salary, and make smart signings this summer.*** It’s worth keeping in mind that trades don’t necessarily have to be made this summer. We have until the middle of the season in 2011 (Jaunary?) before the luxury tax would kick in, so trades could be made up until that point in order to avoid that tax. Even so, Dumars has his work cut out for him, to say the least.
Summing It Up
I don't think salary dumps are the answer (catch the pun?). And while I certainly favor acquiring talent, not cap space, it's going to require some creative and very strategic thinking.
What say you, DBB?
*There is some dispute as to exactly how much Ben Gordon’s contract is worth, either 55 million of 58.2 million over the entirety of the contract. In my opinion, 58.2 is more likely, but regardless of which figure is correct, it has little bearing on available money for the summer of 2010, because the Pistons will likely be over the cap in the summer of 2010. **In my opinion, all of those contracts will carry over from this season to next season. I don’t see Wilcox opting out of that kind of money; Jonas will definitely be back; and, although I’m not particularly high on Summers, he’s young and cheap. ***Unless, of course, our owner is willing to pay the luxury tax, in which case we should retain everyone for now, wait for suitable trade partners, and spend all our available money this summer
Sources:
http://www.storytellerscontracts.info/resources/09-10salaries.htm
http://www.pistonpowered.com/2009/07/salary-cap-ramifications-of-gordon-and-villanueva-signings/
http://www.pistonpowered.com/2009/07/is-ben-gordons-contract-worth-58-million/
http://www.eskimo.com/~pbender/contracts
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4314591
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=4312837
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Comments
Wow!
Nice post. That just solidifies for me how big of a mistake it was signing both CV31 and Ben Gordon this past off season. Here’s to hoping this team can get back to mediocre before the end of the season!
"Under certain circumstances, profanity provides a relief denied even to prayer." -Mark Twain
great post brgulker, that should put end to this tmac silliness.
agreed that we need to trade for talent. i personally dont think we would have a chance at any marquis free agents no matter what the cap space situation was, so i think we should just put that out of our heads.
trading tay seems like a terrible idea after seeing him back in action. someone else said one a different board to wait for him to expire next year and try and make a play for marc gasol. that sounds pretty good. you never know what people are going to give up for expiring deals next year if the cap shrinks again.
sign and trades
Are probably our best option this summer. With so many fa’s on the market, i’m sure teams will want to recoup something for their players, and with tay being on the last year of his contract this summer, his contract will probably be a good chip (same with stuck). And you dismiss it early on, but why not clear tay and rip’s salaries in one go? By some measures, we’ve already replaced rip and tay (daye/bg/jj/summers), and hence, only need to fill the same need we have now, which is a big. And that would at least put us 12 mil. closer to doing so (which should net a pretty good piece). And I like the piece, gulk, even if it is, in essence, a summary of your team building thoughts since last summer.
My comment below was meant to be a response.
One other comment about S&T’s though. Usually, S&T’s are done so that the FA being traded can get the maximum amount of money that is allowed under the current CBA.
I’m struggling to identify a FA who’d be worth that type of money and actually be attainable given the pieces we could return … but if there is one, I’d welcome being corrected on that point.
And you dismiss it early on, but why not clear tay and rip’s salaries in one go?
Don’t get me wrong, I’d love to be free of those contracts. But, I don’t think moving them for 12 million in cap space outweighs holding onto them and spending our $5-8 million exceptions.
sign and trades
Do you have someone in particular in mind? S&T’s are always an option … I just draw a blank when I try to come up with a franchise who would want to do one for the pieces we can offer?
Tay + Stuck = whom? (for example)
And I like the piece, gulk, even if it is, in essence, a summary of your team building thoughts since last summer.
Thanks. I guess it is a repeat of what I’ve said elsewhere … My main point, though, was to debunk the “trade for TMac” threads/comments that keep coming up.
s & t
can be done for max $$ (thinking Joe Johnson) but could also be done to recoup something for the outgoing fa, too. Nobody in mind, particularly, since it’s going to be crazy, but a team like the magic spent big bucks on gortat just to ensure he didn’t walk for free.
by C$ on Jan 6, 2010 3:55 PM EST up reply actions
I don’t think our moves will be done through free agency. That was last offseason. I know that fans are clamoring for us to grab up T-Mac or Big Z or O’Neal, but it would hurt us more than help us, as you have so rightly demonstrated.
In the next year, I think Dumars will trade Rip and Tay for the final pieces to the equation, rather than stepping stones to those final pieces. Dumars has worked miracles before (Bobby Sura, Rebraca, Atkins, and some picks for Rasheed Wallace counts as a miracle, right?), I think he could do it again. Maybe working something up to grab Kaman, Gasol, or someone like Blatche. We also need a playmaker. We’re set at the 2-4, we would be set at the 5 if we could trade either Tay or Rip for one, we just need to trade the other for a pass first, true point guard. Stuckey and Bynum aren’t the answer at the 1, sadly.
Let’s not forget it’s looking very likely that we’ll get a lottery pick this summer, too. So let’s say we get pick 8-12 and use that to grab a playmaker and maybe keep Tayshaun until his contract expires (next year, right?) and trade Rip for a big man, if we can. Though I am sure Tayshaun is the bigger trade bait.
We have to go for trade options right now!
Why? We have too many SGs (Gordon, Hamilton, Stuckey!) and SFs (Prince, Daye, Summers, Jerebko) on our Team!
I like Hamilton & Prince for what both have done for the Pistons. But the era of the 2004 Pistons is completly over. After tradeing Billups, it was just a matter of time to pull the trigger on tay & rip! By signing Gordon, JD did the fundamental for trading Rip.
And the injury of Tay has shown, that Jerebko & Daye really have talent! And with Tay back in our Lineup, Daye won’t get serious playingtime. Jerebko is a hybrid forward who is able to play SF & PF well! So splitting his minutes on both spots could work.
I hope Joe D pull the Trigger right now. The playoffs seems to be far far away. Let’s use the time to develop our rookies by giving them more time on the court! Let’s trade Rip and/or Tay now for a big man (most of them with expiering contracts) and/or a real PG! We could use the rest of the season to find our chemistry with this young team (new PG an/or Big man + bynum, stuckey, gordon, daye, jerebko, cv, wilcox and maybe maxiell).
Use the coming Off season to fix the last problems (final pieces / role player) and add more talent with a good draft pick! Maybe Joe D is willing to trade one of them (hamilton/tay) now and use the other one for more flexibility in the upcoming off season (try to trade for the final piece or for a better draft pick like the timberwolves did in 2009!?)
Good post
I pretty much agree, I was having an argument with fellow Pistons fans about the same subject, cap space. I think Detroit might have better trade opportunities after this offseason, Tay will be a expiring contract and teams will go back to being willing to go into long term contracts so someone might take on Rip.
Also after a season of play, the set of Jonas, Daye, Bynum and in the right situation even Stuckey can be incentives for trades.
Oh, and gal here.
by Kriz on Jan 7, 2010 7:14 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Getting assets AND cap room
There may be a way to finesse this with a multiplayer trade for an asset and an expiring contract. For example, we could trade Rip and Maxiell for Varejao and Ilgauskas. For next year this gives us a starter at Center AND 10.6m off our payroll (putting us something like 5m under the cap). Whatever you think of the merits of this particular trade, it shows that we have an opportunity to reduce the luxury tax pressure and have talent because we’re paying $24m for 48 minutes at shooting guard with gordon and hamilton.
by Arrow1 on Jan 7, 2010 8:57 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Thinking beyond next year
We might also want to err on the side of dumping salary because we will have to resign Stuckey and our rookies over the next few years.
and don't forget
the lottery pick we’ll be taking this summer, too
by C$ on Jan 7, 2010 9:49 AM EST up reply actions
because we will have to resign Stuckey
I’m not sure that’s a given in Joe’s mind. I think it’s very likely, but I’m not 100% certain.
Joe has already publicly said that Will Bynum is a part of his long-term thinking. He’s praised Stuckey as well, but to my knowledge, he’s never said publicly that Stuckey is a part of the long-term plan.
I think before Joe commits to Stuckey over the long term, Stuckey has to show some improvement. But of course, that’s just IMO. I’m speculating quite a bit there.
One thing to remember: the CBA is to our advantage when we’re resigning our own players. If retaining Stuckey is Joe’s end-game for PG, then the Pistons will be in a better position than any other team, because of the way the CBA and salary cap work. In short, we can go over the cap to retain our own players.
Stuckey is the long-term answer at the 2
…maybe. But he’s not a point guard. Who penetrates as much as he does and only gets 4 assists per game? Shooting guards.
Anyway, if we pick up his option for next year, then let him play on the qualifying offer the year after, we will have seen him play full seasons at age 24 and 25—the start of his peak. At that point we’ll really know what we have and will have the bird rights to sign him (unless he’s really pissed that we made him play in 2011 for the $3.8m qualifying offer and he walks).
Stuckey Is So Polarizing
He has skills, but he he’s no fun to watch. He scores points, but he makes a lot of mistakes (and sometimes he doesn’t even score points). I hope he can put it all together this year and work on the jumper this summer. It would make it a little easier to talk about long term plans if we knew what we had in him.
by garrettelliott on Jan 7, 2010 10:26 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Is Stuckey like Maggette?
A Warriors fan friend of mine said people call Maggette “bad porn”: lot’s of penetration and scoring, but still no fun to watch.
Stuckey actually reminds me of baron davis
by Roll The Dyess on Jan 10, 2010 2:26 PM EST up reply actions
Rip + Tay?
Why, when talking trades, does the majority of pistons fans immediately assume Rip and/or Tay? I’d trade everyone away before I trade Rip, Tay i could go either way on. My trade me pecking order goes like: CV31, BG, then Wilcox. I’d give those guys away if i could.
I don't necessarily assume that
It was just as place to start the conversation.
I agree with you, to a large extent though — just some qualifiers.
Rip is getting old. He’s aged well so far, but the older a player gets, the more he gets injured and the longer it takes to recover. I won’t be a bit surprised if we don’t see another 82-game season out of Rip.
I also think that fans perceive BG as the SG of the future because Joe signed him for all that money. Personally, I don’t think Joe will hesitate to move anyone on the roster (except the young guys on cheap contracts, unless it’s necessary to make another deal work), and I’ve been pretty vocal about my displeasure with Gordon’s contract since the get-go.
The argument in favor of keeping BG over Rip is this, and I think it carries at least some weight: Rip and BG offer you very similar things at the same position. Each has strengths and weaknesses that are different from the other, but at the end of the day, they’ll get you 18-20 points out of your SG position. Gordon is younger and is likely to stay healthy longer, and his skills won’t noticeably diminish during the length of his contract.
A further argument in your favor of retaining Rip, I think, is that his trade value has been driven down by age, contract size and length, and frankly Ben Gordon.
As to Tay, there’s a growing sense (and I think it’s a bit premature) that Tay has become expendable because of Jonas and Daye. IMO, he’s also overpaid (a little). On the one hand, as MP has brought up, Tay’s contract is expiring soon, so rushing to trade his talent and his contract may be worse for us than simply letting it expire — and then either let him walk or take steps to retain him.
The argument in favor of moving him, I think, is that he’s still perceived as a valuable player, and although I think he’s overpaid a little, he’s only overpaid a little. He’s a very, very nice complementary player that I’m sure any contending team would love to have. And his contract is huge, and it’s almost over. In this day and age, his contract is probably the most movable of any of our key players.
As to moving CV: I’d like to see 2 months of healthy play from him before I make a final judgment. He’s not my favorite player by any stretch, but he has taken some strides when he’s been healthy.
Tayshaun could help several teams amongst the real and fringe contenders (boston, orlando, portland, dallas), and generally the contenders have spent to win now and are not going to be players in free agency this coming summer.
I can’t envision a scenario where another team wants to take rip’s contract, with the possible exception of houston or dallas using their expiring contracts to add multiple rotation guys and load up for a title run this year (which would probably require some sort of 3-team deal).
and painful as it is to mention, the pistons would be picking either #5 or 6 overall in the draft (based on current standings). given that most of the players projected in that area of the draft are not centers, that pick could be used to facilitate your “assets for assets” strategy. (I would hope for at least top-1 protection—john wall or bust!)
Rip and Tay for a Big Man
The next person who suggests to trade Richard Hamilton and Tayshaun prince for a big man? I will gouge my eyes out in response… You need to think for a minute… Who gives up big men? Declining teams with an aging big man… Yeah… Thats pretty much it… The best trade for RIP your gonna get is RIP, Chucky Atkins 1st round pick/couple junk picks for Harden, Collison, and Seflolosha…
Harden doesn’t make a lot of sense behind Westbrook on a team looking to take the next step… RIP gives them a veteran #2 or #3 scorer with range AND they dump Sefolosha… Detroit gets to start a great prospect, move Stuckey to the two guard, tank the rest of the season AND Nick Collisons and Tays deals expiring next summer? Everyone wins… Except Chucky Atkins… Give it up dude…
dump sefolosha?
He’s one of their best defenders and i’ve read a lot of articles saying how important he is for them, so i don’t think they’d look at it that way. And harden/sefolosha are both sg’s, so that wouldn’t allow any move for stuckey.
by C$ on Jan 8, 2010 11:40 AM EST up reply actions
Need some education...
Wow! Great post and great research.
There’s one part of this, in Option 1, that I don’t understand. Perhaps someone can enlighten me. It’s this section:
And just under $12 million to replace Rip and Tay and find a big man (as well as positions 12-14 on the roster, probably draft picks or minimum contracts). That’s a tall order. Also, I think Houston values the cap space McGrady’s expiring deal will create for them, and I suspect his contract isn’t available.
The $12M figure that is used here is figuring against the salary cap, but if the luxury tax would kick in at $62M, what would prevent the Pistons from spending back up to their current commitment level of $57M-ish, so that they would actually have about $17M (over even $20M) that they could spend?
(Even if this is plausible, I’m not necessarily saying it would be enough to replace Rip+Tay and acquire a quality big. Nor am I saying that it would to be wise to spend up like that given the extensions that they may be dealing with in the next few years.)
How dare you besmirch my other, but just as important as Kwame liege
Jod Eumars
"We’re going to turn this team around 360 degrees." –Jason Kidd
Assets for Assets
has anyone presented any “realistic” trades that don’t involve expiring contracts like tmac or boozer?
who/what can reasonably be had? what do we fans think is needed?
Therein lies the problem
I’m not sure there will be a trade this season, as so many teams are getting hit by the economy and shrinking cap.
It may be more likely that this summer and next season are more realistic times for those moves to be made.
Really? That all you could come up with?
So your solution is to trade our good players with big conratcts for other good players with small contracts? Gee you are smart. I hope no one around the leauge figures out what we are doing!!!
Now a more doable solution.
Tank the season and hope we pick in the top 3 or so. Pick the best point or big man available. Package Tey or Rip and Stucky or Maxiel for a top 10 pick and some chump we can dump right away. Give them cash if required to complete the deal. Pick a point or big man, whatever is left and not picked on the first choice. With the money saved get a good replacment for the people traded.
This would need Joe to make sound draft decisions, can anyone say Darko, for a change.
All we can do is hope.
Oh, and I liked this comment,
With the money saved get a good replacment for the people traded.
which was preceded by this little beauty:
Really? That all you could come up with?
You offer a completely nondescript solution — use money to sign players — after criticizing me for not offering a good enough attempt.
Irony.
I’m all for critiquing my ideas, but if you’re going to do so, at least offer something intelligible and substantive by way of response.
by brgulker on Jan 11, 2010 10:11 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Yes
Because tanking works.
And because someone with a top-10 pick will want those contracts.
by Birdman84 on Jan 9, 2010 10:06 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
I Ben Wallace block the notion of tanking
I understand the argument but it’s not happening in the D.
"We’re going to turn this team around 360 degrees." –Jason Kidd
by Skylar on Jan 10, 2010 3:22 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
The biggest key.
Watch for teams trying to make a playoff push towards the deadline. Cleveland comes to mind as a team with an expiring, some assets, and in need of an upgrade at SG.
Dallas might be interested in a true SG. After handing Marion a nice contract extension, they’ve shown they aren’t afraid of spending money. With Howard not playing effectively, I could see a Howard/Rip swap going down.
Even Denver could show some interest thanks to their struggles. Pairing up one of the most effective back-courts in NBA history is always tempting.
Right now things seem hopeless because there’s still a month before the deadline. Just watch, there will be interest in Hamilton.
by Terrence J. Lynch on Jan 11, 2010 12:02 AM EST reply actions
None taken.
But Dumars has done a good job of cleaning up his messes.
Draft Darko? He at least he got Stuckey out of it, which is more than Darko is actually worth.
Nazr’s bad contract? Got two expirings, one who is a somewhat useful player.
I believe Rip will be moved, though you might have to wait until after the season. It’s a tough call, if teams want to seriously compete and need help, Rip is a possible addition.
by Terrence J. Lynch on Jan 11, 2010 4:16 AM EST up reply actions
In Jod's dreams
Even Denver could show some interest thanks to their struggles.
Denver? They need PF/C depth above all else. How does Rip help them?
You don't think a Billups/Hamilton reunion isn't tempting.
Obviously they need frontcourt help as well, but if they make a move for Rip without weakening their frontline any further, they’ll do it.
by Terrence J. Lynch on Jan 11, 2010 2:47 AM EST up reply actions
also denver was really reluctant to take on any sort of salary in the off season.
dont know if they would be down with getting rip at his price tag. also if they arent going to trade a big to us then who could we possibly want from them other than just getting out from under rips contract?
JR Smith, Renaldo Balkman, and Malik Allen for Rip Hamilton and DaJaun Summers
Smith moves in and out of Karl’s dog house. He’s also not playing particularly well (not that Rip is, either). Of course, I agree with dandresden about there reluctance to add salary, but I think with what Billups has done for that franchise, he could get in the owners ear about this deal and get it done.
by Terrence J. Lynch on Jan 11, 2010 4:13 AM EST up reply actions
oh man just think about a jr smith/ben gordon backcourt.
shot selection be damned im shooting a 40 ft 3 pointer!
he could get in the owners ear about this deal and get it done.
Dude, if Rip+Tay+Dice+Big Ben couldn’t convinced Joe to keep the old crew together, how on earth could you expect just Billups to convince his owner to take on a multi-million dollar contract for an obviously declining SG, when they’ve already got two young SGs on the roster, one of them still on his rookie deal?
Kind of hard to convince JoD
To keep the crew together when you fall flat on your face 4 years in a row. Maybe if they wanted to stay together, they wouldn’t get shamed by LeBron or just plain quit against Boston.
by Terrence J. Lynch on Jan 11, 2010 8:46 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Denver not a possibility
Denver doesn’t want big contracts.
They don’t need a SG, in the first place, because they’ve got Afflalo and Lawson playing on the cheap anyway. What they do need is more depth inside, but they’re already in luxury cap danger anyway.
Taking on Rip’s contract is something they just won’t do. He doesn’t push them over the top in terms of talent, and he does push them over the top with respect to the luxury tax for years to come.
I'll tell you right now
Rip would jump at the chance to reunite with Billiups.
"We’re going to turn this team around 360 degrees." –Jason Kidd
I got love for both of those guys
But I want positivity within the ranks and nothing but spiteful dirty meanass basketball for those who dare challenge the Detroit Pistons. Trade Rip to Denver. They are open to moving anyone not named Carmelo or Chauncey. I’ve read this on the internet so it must be true.
"We’re going to turn this team around 360 degrees." –Jason Kidd
It appears that Dumars agrees with you.
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=AnIQCgsbODY7EtPMdQZveL68vLYF?slug=ap-misfiringpistons&prov=ap&type=lgns
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