But What About the Lottery Balls: Pistons 124, Sixers 103
by Packey on Apr 6, 2010 11:48 PM EDT
in Detroit Pistons Recaps
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PrintEverything was going according to plan.
The Pistons were making some games interesting, and others not, but most importantly were on their way to closing out this mega-miserable season on an epic 17-game losing streak to all but solidify enough ping pong balls for a top three pick in this June's draft. Fans had officially become numb to all the losses, starting to re-think mass suicide (maybe), and suddenly hopeful that the Pistons were, for once, doing something right this season.
Alas, something went terribly awry, though.
Somewhere along the way, amongst missed flights, Twit-therapy, words of wisdom, and punted basketballs, the Pistons found some life for their Tuesday night game against the Philadelphia 76ers.
The Pistons ill-advisedly shot 63% from the field (47% from downtown!) and had seven players score in double figures en route to a crushing 124-103 win. Instead of being tied for the third worst record in the NBA with the Warriors (136-137 lottery combinations), the Pistons now find themselves tied for the fourth fifth worst record with the Wizards and Kings (90 75-76 lottery combinations). Further, the loss for the 76ers means that they are within striking distance, now just two games behind the Pistons.
Tragic.
In all seriousness, it was great to see the Pistons show that they haven't forgotten how to win. If the Pistons were capable of playing like this every night, I don't think we'd all be so depressed as a result of this season. Sadly, I think this was simply a case of the Pistons caring way more than the 76ers do at this point.
Some Box Score notes:
- Ben Wallace was a monster tonight, racking up 18 points and six rebounds in 24+ minutes (27 points and nine rebounds per 36).
- CV31 walked the tweet and scored 25 points in 23 minutes (roughly 38 points per 36)
- Austin Daye had nine and nine in 22 minutes.
- I wish there would have been more minutes for Summers, but one can't really complain when everyone else was en fuego.
- Stuckey was elbowed in the ribs during the game and appeared to be seriously hurt, again. He sank his free throw and left for X-rays, but returned to finish the game when those X-rays came up negative. Boss.
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How to tell you've had a bad season...
a win can be bad.
My Music: Some Sorta Giant
My Blog: Strike Three Mechanics
Have faith
They will start loosing again. they just need that win so the record would stay put.. Im sure they wont win anymore.. GO PISTONs.
Kings loss changed the lottery numbers a bit
edits will show that.
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It's crazy rooting for losses
Look at the Blazers with Greg Oden. You never know what you are going to get. The Celtics tanked and then lucked out by NOT getting one of the top two picks. The Cs never make those blockbuster moves if they get get Oden or Durant. I’m just happy for the good win and to see some talent finally on display. The Bulls had a recent #1 pick in Derrick Rose and a #4 in Tyrus Thomas and it got them nothing. Winning teaches you how to win. Losing teaches you how to suck. Look at the lottery vortex of suck that has been the Clippers for a generation. Top picks don’t mean jack.
the nba is seemingly one of the few sports designed to keep the winners winning
most teams above the cap = no major FA market, trading a contract is as important as trading a player sometimes, lottery system designed to screw the worst teams by making an order jumble
they say one player can make a ton of difference (lebron, jordan) more so than in any sport …
Good. Bad. I'm the guy with the gun.
by sauce1977 on Apr 7, 2010 12:45 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Look at Chris Paul
You can’t expect to get a better player than Chris Paul in the draft but it takes a lot more than one player to win in the NBA. The Hornets aren’t close WITH a superstar. The Pistons are the only team to win in recent years without 2 superstars on the team and last time I checked the Pistons have zero on this team. For better or worse I think Joe Dumars thinks if he can get a gritty 45 win team he’s always one trade for the equivalent of a disgruntled Rasheed Wallace away from another ring. Maybe that’s stupid and maybe the GM game is passing Jod by and you need to do deeper scouting and more stats analysis and value analysis like they do in Houston, Portland and OKC but I like rooting for the Pistons the way they are. Rooting for them to lose is like being a Teal Piston and who wants that?
in no way
do i condone tanking, i personally don’t want them to do that even if there was Mr. Perfect Basketball God Player sitting there @ #1 overall. i don’t think anyone should want that.
i hoped this day would never come again, i mean i knew how hard it would be to rise out from the locked basement that is the national basquettebawl ass-ocean.
Good. Bad. I'm the guy with the gun.
by sauce1977 on Apr 7, 2010 1:00 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I don't mind tanking.
It’s helped out a few teams and it’s fucked over a few others. Either way, no one’s watching the games at this point when you’re this bad, so you might as well try to better your odds at getting a game-changer. Are there Oden/Thabeet’s out there? Obviously. But we suck a fat D anyway this year, so why not see if it works out for us.
then this is just my opinion
if i’m a pro player and the message is all but sent (or explicitly sent) that we’re not trying to win these games, that you should take it easy … in my case they’d invent some injury and keep me out of the game …. because if i’m healthy i’m balls to the motherfucking wall out there. i can’t play any other way.
i get offended if the management even begins to look like they’re crapping the bed on purpose. i want out, i go to the gm, and if he doesn’t take it seriously, i take my chances with the unwritten rules about snitching and i let it be known this team is tanking.
because it isn’t professional, pretty much. not even Doom music could make tanking better.
Good. Bad. I'm the guy with the gun.
I don’t think that some of our players share your mindset, sauce. They should, but I don’t think they do.
yeah i'm just saying from a standpoint of being set up to fail
i’m not talking about the clueless stupidity joe dipshitted together last offseason or the in-general lunching from some players on certain nights, a specific indirect or direct management engineering (coach calls dumb plays from the sideline, a top player is healthy but they’re not playing him any minutes), that kinda thing.
Good. Bad. I'm the guy with the gun.
i agree that the players should have that attitude. tanking is usually more subtle though. if we were really trying to tank, we would have benched stuckey after his injury, would have put summers in for villanueva even though he was hot, etc. it’s not so much saying “don’t try hard” as it’s putting in less skilled players at important moments.
totally agree with you
Tanking can get us a better player in the draft, but it could just as easily create all sorts of internal problems with the players we have. I understand the allure of tanking, but I am almost always opposed to it.
by bugman222 on Apr 7, 2010 6:00 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I tend to suspect that tanking
isn’t as conscious a decision as we like to think. Perhaps coaches are told to go out and lose, but I imagine that this is rare. Now with nothing real to play for in a lost season, do teams take minutes from proven veteran commodities and give them to currently lesser producers to see what they can offer? Sure. But that—in addition to likely leading to more losses—makes some long term basketball sense. And if one of your go-to guys has been battling injuries all year, doesn’t it make sense to shut him down (or at least curtail his minutes) to alleviate the fear his reinjuring himself?
Even more so, I am skeptical of the idea that players are told to not play hard. Rip, Tay, Rodney, Will may not be around next year. Why would they care who the Pistons draft? And why would they choose to diminish their own value and reputations just to provide an abstract entity called “The Detroit Pistons” with more ping pong balls.
What I do think happens is that a sense of pointlessness and despair seeps into the locker room and most players have a hard time motivating themselves to provide maximum focus, energy, and effort for a 25 win team playing in front of half-empty arenas. These guys are almost certainly not dogging it for the sake of the franchise and I’d be shocked if anyone in management is even hinting that they should do so. But it’s hard to see the motivation for spirited maximum effort. And this is a situation that leads to more losses. (And, yes…more ping pong balls.)
by MrHappyMushroom on Apr 7, 2010 7:40 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
brain has the dumb
if i’m a pro player and the message is all but sent (or explicitly sent) that we’re not trying to win these games, i’m an angry panda.*
Good. Bad. I'm the guy with the gun.
I can't believe I'm even saying this
But if there was a Mr. Perfect Basketball God I would take one tanked year for sure. Like calling nill in spades. Fuck it. I’m sure Cleavland fans don’t give a shit about the shit season that produced LBJ. Or the Spurs, Boston the list goes on . That’s the way this league is built like it or not . So I say fuck it. Winning won’t help with shit at this point. I also hope this never happens again cause I hate this shit too.
Why? To me tanking is like filing for bankruptcy
You’re forfeiting the short-term by filing for bankruptcy so your company has a chance at staying solvent in the long-term. Just like with bankruptcy there is no guarantee that filing for it will solve your problems in the long-term but it gives you a better shot than you’d have if you didn’t file…And winning a game in the last 7 or 8 which now puts us tied for 5th with Sacramento instead of tied for 3rd with Golden State is pretty frustrating.
What is probably the most frustrating is that I didn’t get to watch most of this game and the lack of defense that ensued (seriously, I think what I watched last night was a collective effort from the bottom of the barrel to boost their stats by the end of the season because there was little to no defense played in this game by either team) because my girlfriend was so excited to watch John Cusack get destroyed in 2012.
PS – I have no idea what I’m talking about when it comes to bankruptcy but the comparison made sense to me!
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
Truth Bomb!
Good thing I already paid a billion euros to get on the super boat.
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
by The Boourns on Apr 7, 2010 2:44 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
A new strategy for next year?
Make Daye and Charlie fly commercial to every away game and live tweet their travels.
And maybe...
We can have Kuester punt the ball during player introductions to get the team fired up.
The Adventures of Austin and Charlie!
Has kind of a nice ring to it. They could do fun things like Nash and Phoenix do on their flights…
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
Who Cares If You Pick....
……3rd or 6th?…..You stil get a great player…..This si so dumb when people start hoping the team loses….I want my pistons win…..So if they pick 3rd or 8th I dont care your going to get a solid solid player…..GO PISTONS!!!!
by BennieBladesFan on Apr 7, 2010 10:01 AM EDT reply actions
…3rd and 6th is the difference between Cousins and Aminu…
Tanking sucks, but it’s silly to pretend that picking higher isn’t usually important. You can’t always depend on someone taking a Thabeet/Darko with the 2nd pick.
Ok whats the difference....
……both great players….next.
by BennieBladesFan on Apr 7, 2010 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Bennie...
One win is not a huge deal…4 wins in the last 8 games will push us from bottom of the barrel to middle of the pack. In my mind, picking 8-12 in this draft could really suck…lots of players with high draft status due to potential and athleticism and not necessarily solid talent…not to mention the fact that Montiejunas is speculated to go somewhere in the 10-14 range.
And the difference between 3rd and 7th right now (especially if Aldrich has a good draft workout) could be the difference between a legit ready to contribute post presence and a project.
At this point in the season, its easier to lose than it is to win. Prior to the tweeting episode, I liked CV’s mindset. Already thinking about next year. There is nothing left to think about this year. They’re a team that under-delievered on the expectations they had of themselves and the expectations of their fans. No one cares how much they under-delivered by so what does it matter if they lose the rest of their games?
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
Yup It Could....
…..So dont draft the project….Pretty simple.
by BennieBladesFan on Apr 7, 2010 5:28 PM EDT up reply actions
You can't just say "don't draft a project" when picking in 5-10...
In fact, I’d argue that any pick outside of 1-5 is being picked just as much on potential as they are on their ability to deliver on day 1. Looking at draft classes from 2000 through 2007, there is only one instance where picks 6-10 were arguably on par or better than those drafted 1-5. Furthermore, the picks drafted 6-10 in most draft classes are closer in line with the performance of players drafted 11-15 than they are to those drafted 1-5.
So in short, there is a huge difference and ultimately with JoD at the helm it could be the difference between say Rodney Rogers (10th overall) and Pau Gasol (3rd overall)…or the difference between Rafael Araujo (8th overall) and Emeka Okafor (2nd overall)…or the ultimate comparison…the difference between Robert Traylor (6th overall) and Antawn Jamison (4th overall)…
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
Props to CV31
We’ve been hard on Chunky Charlie (deservedly so) for most of this year, but he played really well last night.
Well enough for me to be hopeful that he can be part of the solution, rather than the problem for the Pistons long-term.
/rainbowed
by Big Z in Orlando on Apr 7, 2010 10:25 AM EDT reply actions
I don't care what it means for our ping pong balls.
I like winning.
I root for the Tigers, Pistons, Red Wings and yes, the Lions.
Me in 140 characters
by ReichardZ on Apr 7, 2010 11:15 AM EDT reply actions 2 recs
Jeez we can't even tank right.
but on the bright side I did make this delicious kool-aid for everyone
The whole tanking vs. not tanking argument is pretty moot at this point. We’re just not good enough to win games, even if we’re trying as hard as we can to win.
Definitely true.
Just look at who Detroit has lost to this season. Some absolutely piss poor teams. Guys gotta get dealt and we need some new faces for next year. Another season like this is unacceptable.
"Take it off the rack, if it's wack, put it back. I like the Whopper, fuck the Big Mac." - Rob Base, It Takes Two, 1988
On picking high
It’s the GM’s job to get the pick he wants. If there is a player at #3 that Dumars thinks is the difference between championship basketball and mediocrity then move a chip to get there but you can’t have it every way in a competitive environment. Detroit is losing today in part because many of Joe Dumars’ favorite players either weren’t that good or he gave up on them. He raved about Afflalo but somehow that went out the window when Ben Gordon was available and now Afflalo is starting SG on a 50 win team.
Is the difference between the 3rd pick and the 8th pick like giving away a starting SG on a reasonable contract in salary cap league? I don’t think so and that didn’t involve losing on purpose. I like competition. Losing on purpose makes it either wrestling or theater, both of which are something different than competitive sports. If it’s not OK for a player to take a few bucks to throw a game, why would it be OK for an organization to lose games on purpose to get better assets in the draft? They are both examples of not competing for gain.
Tanking
This roster is just not well comprised, and guys have got to go. This team will go nowhere as currently constructed. That’s not tanking, that’s just very poor play for the course of one season.
"Take it off the rack, if it's wack, put it back. I like the Whopper, fuck the Big Mac." - Rob Base, It Takes Two, 1988
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