Joe Dumars Didn't See Grit and Toughness Last Year; Wants Grit and Toughness Next Year
by Packey on May 25, 2010 2:39 PM EDT
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PrintThis morning Joe Dumars had his annual post-season press conference with the media to discuss last season and the future of our beloved Detroit Pistons. It was nothing too out of the ordinary: he didn't like last season and he wants Detroit to get back to playing vintage Pistons basketball.
Via MLIVE:
"We didn't play with the same grit and toughness that we played with over the past 10 years," Dumars said. "That's the whole focus right now for us is to get back to the grit and toughness that's identified us for the past decade."
"What I didn't like was the way that we played this year," he said. "What I didn't like was the lack of toughness we had. What I didn't like was the grit that we didn't show this year. All those things bothered me just as much as the losses themselves, just the way we lost."
Dumars repeated himself so much that it would have forced one of you to post a picture of a dead horse getting pummeled by the "Office Space" guys:
At one point Dumars said, "I know I'm beating a dead horse."
As we'd expect the GM to say, losing was a learning experience and has Dumars realizing now, more than ever, that the Pistons need to get back to their roots:
"You just don’t learn from winning. You learn from losing as well. And what we’ve learned is that we’re more committed now than ever before to maintain our core values and not get away from that and not have the type of slippage that you saw this year."
Like most of us, he has second guessed himself about last summer's free agent signings, but he also believes they will be better next year:
"I wish we could have gotten more out of them this year," Dumars said. "They were two guys that got hurt and were out for a little bit, coming to a new team, trying to learn a new system. I think both of them will be better this year, I really do. I think they both went through an experience this year, coming into a new situation, trying to fit in and fighting injuries and so on. I expect both of them to be better this year."
Ultimately, I don't think we learn anything new from this press conference. He said he's still open to anything, but perhaps the biggest hint of his current thought process was what he said about watching this year's playoffs (in reference to questions about Tayshaun Prince and Richard Hamilton):
"All of those teams have older vets and kept them around, but put the right pieces around them,"
In the end, we're basically back to where we were yesterday - speculation city and we're the Mayor.
UPDATE: If you want to watch a 5 minute clip of his press conference, you can do so here.
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I'm confused
Last summer, the line from Pistons’ brass was “These aren’t going to be your father’s Pistons.”
This summer, the line from Pistons’ brass is, “We need to return to who we were for the past decade.”
Not that I’m unhappy with the change (I’m thrilled, actually.) But WTF, Jod? What are you trying to build here?
by brgulker on May 25, 2010 3:35 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Does this mean
I can give up on hopes of Aminu, Donuts and Monrover? (get it? I combined Monroe and Turnover!!!)
"not by the face, but by the name they knew him-- racist against rappers, they all look the same to him"
by Mike Payne on May 25, 2010 3:37 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I don't get it...
sad panda
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
Joe needs to stop playing it safe
We’ve already unleashed the a-bomb, tested the h-bomb (it did indeed toast our marshmallows quite well) and it’s about time JoeD finally brought about the f-bomb. I’d feel a lot better about next season if he went ballistic
by bearded thundar on May 25, 2010 3:38 PM EDT reply actions
So...since we have nothing better to do, I'll extrapolate his comment about key vets
Rip and Tayshaun both stay and we continue down the same path while somehow hoping that CV and BG will acquire the grit and toughness that we expect from any player playing for the Stones.
So we draft at #7 and take Monroe (assuming he’s there at 7) who actually has shown little mental toughness/defensive grit over Aldrich who has shown boatloads of both.
Prediction for next season’s record: 30-52 and another lottery night sighting (although hopefully this time it’s Jerebko sitting up there).
Additionally, we use our MLE to acquire Tracy McGrady.
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
or trade Stuckey, BG, CV and/or #7 pick
I don’t think keeping Prince/Rip necessarily means they don’t make other moves to get better. Rip and Prince are just their best trading pieces, IMO. They could always keep one over the other, too.
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yeah I'm just being all gloom and doom
If we want to be gritty again then we need to trade CV. Mainly because I refuse to believe that anyone incapable of having 5 o’clock shadow would be capable of having or retaining any levels of grit deemed worthwhile.
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
I think a guy with no eyebrows can be pretty intimidating. I want to see more of what he did to old man Juwan.
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Okay but only if they permanently furrow their brow.
Wait are people without eybrows capable of furrowing their brow?
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
furrowing one’s skin where the brow is supposed to be
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He could just draw angry eyebrows on and then he’d look permanently gritty.
by garrettelliott on May 25, 2010 6:40 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
good call
And he should probably get some tats to cover up those flabby arms.
or, you know, work out.
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STTRRRRRONG BAAAAAAD
BURNINATE THE COUNTRYSIDE.
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
I don't assume this means he wants to hold on to Rip and Tay.
Everybody knows at this point the Pistons either want or need to rid themselves of Rip, there is no need to make it sound more desperate. Assign some value to their presence so other teams don’t think they can lowball you (they can and will) and cover yourself (particularly towards these vets) if you can’t trade them.
Where in the world is Cheikh Samb?
by Kriz on May 25, 2010 4:31 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs
agreed
It’s the same thing with Minnesota and Al Jefferson. Had their GM not announced they were looking to trade and their fans not come here trying to find ways to sell him for another lottery pick, I’m sure I for one would be willing to give up more for him.
by bearded thundar on May 25, 2010 4:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Trade Scenario: Sacramento & Detroit
So let’s say for the purpose of this trade that Cousins falls to #5…what are your thoughts on the following trade:
Tayshaun Prince
Jason Maxiell
- (Monroe)
Nocioni
Udrih
- (Cousins)
Would you do it? Nocioni and Udrih would both offer us solid backups at the SF and PG position while the #5 would drastically improve us inside. We shed Max’s contract in the making.
I always hated the fuck out of Nocioni when he was playing for the better bulls teams of a few years back and my hatred is almost always derived from the level of frustration I have when the Pistons play that team (Varejao and Noah both come to mind).
I think this trade has its merits although I know many feel that Udrih is not that good. When you compare last season’s stats (a bit unfair given the number of games Bynum missed), Udrih would actually be a fair valued backup PG. Higher defensive rating than Bynum, lower usage , significantly better TS, shot 38% from beyond the arc, and is not an undersized PG at 6’3".
Nocioni again is a serviceable backup SF who in 20 minutes per game put up 8.5/3 and shot 38% from beyond the arc. Of course, to me, this is only worthwhile if we can net Cousins. Not much point in doing this unless we can grab him as well…
Stuckey/Udrih
Rip/BG
Jerebko/Nocioni/Daye
Wallace/CV
Cousins/MLE/2nd round big
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
What the hell?
SBN fucked me! both picks show up as 1. while in actuality it should be read as Detroit geting Sacramento’s #5 which we’d use on Cousins and Sacramento would trade down to acquire the #7 and Monroe.
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
well you better buy it dinner
or get a good lawyer, depending on how the fucking went (then again, I’ve never heard of a man being raped, as it can’t be rape if it’s voluntary)
That would be interesting though. Udrih is a good pg, he’s just well overpaid (not so sure on Nocioni though)
by bearded thundar on May 25, 2010 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions
umm
“I’ve never heard of a man being raped, as it can’t be rape if it’s voluntary”
Really? Think about this. One word: prison
just EPINION
joe dumars in free agency : prison rape :: andy dufrane : shawshank
"not by the face, but by the name they knew him-- racist against rappers, they all look the same to him"
Congrats!
You just passed the verbal portion of the SAT
just EPINION
by real Rob G on May 26, 2010 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Isn't Nocioni soft as Twinkie filling?
And Udrih has a pretty crappy contract. Actually, even if this trade gets us Cousins, it also cripples us too. Everybody bitches now about how we’ve got tons of cash tied up in bench players, this only worsens that. So in other words, I’m not down for it.
by Biz Markie Moon on May 25, 2010 5:38 PM EDT up reply actions
i know i have expressed this
but i think a cole aldrich would be a perfect tit for our team. A guy that is going to improve with playing time and is a tall good defensive player.
"perfect tit"
pretty Freudian, I’d say
just EPINION
by real Rob G on May 25, 2010 9:12 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Dumars didn't see grit and toughness...
because he didn’t put together a roster with those qualities.
Also, I cannot express, in words, how much I do not want Cole Aldrich on this team.
He's not all that tall
In addition to all of the other reasons I hope we dont take Aldrich, as of the pre-draft measurements he is 6’9".
Gonna have a tough time playing the 5 when he is well undersized and at best moderately athletic.
most nba players are measured with shoes on, so if he’s legit 6’9 then thats 6’11 in nba style numbers, d. howard is 6’9 so is perkins i think.
by bags fly free on May 25, 2010 8:02 PM EDT up reply actions
Dwight Howard is not 6'9", by any measure
"The Lakers were favored 8 to 1 odds to beat the Pistons. Bullshit." - Bill Davidson, Championship parade, 2004
dwight was measured at 6'9" without shoes his rookie year....
for whatever thats worth
Maxiell and I once shared a box of baby-ohs for breakfast.
I might be wrong, I guess
Just looks so much taller, but granted that’s TV
"The Lakers were favored 8 to 1 odds to beat the Pistons. Bullshit." - Bill Davidson, Championship parade, 2004
players falisify listings
It’s not so much that’s he more than 6’10" in shoes, it’s rather that the other players are shorter than they claim to be. For instance, Maxiell is only 6’5" and when Rodney and Ben stand next to each other, they seem only about an inch apart despite that Ben is listed at 6’9"
by bearded thundar on May 26, 2010 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions
sheed’s also considered only 6’9 and KG is listed at 6’11 but looks a lot taller than perkins who is 6’10
by don'tworryaboutit on May 26, 2010 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Sheed’s 6’10" without shoes, and 7 foot with them and KG is 6’11" without shoes and 7+ with them. I couldn’t find Perkins’ combine measurements, but I think that 6’10" is with shoes and some pixey dust
by bearded thundar on May 26, 2010 4:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Please
don’t ever, ever, compare Dwight howard to cole aldrich. It makes us all look bad.
by C$ on May 26, 2010 9:57 AM EDT up reply actions
Cole Aldrich
White Howard?
"not by the face, but by the name they knew him-- racist against rappers, they all look the same to him"
by Mike Payne on May 26, 2010 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
6'9" only works at center if you're Ben Wallace
"The Lakers were favored 8 to 1 odds to beat the Pistons. Bullshit." - Bill Davidson, Championship parade, 2004
Ben is shorter
Quite a bit actually, Blaha and Special K loved to make note of that, as it makes Ben’s accomplishments even more impressive
by bearded thundar on May 26, 2010 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions
I wonder what Ben’s stats are, like his reach and hand size, and vertical (in his prime)? Is that on teh innerwebz any where?
by garrettelliott on May 26, 2010 1:58 PM EDT up reply actions
he went undrafted
So the reach must not have been very good, but I bet you he had close to a 45" vertical (and I wouldn’t be surprised if it was more). Big Ben not only has a great set of genetics but also is one of the best conditioned athletes in the world; it’s incredible just how many joules of energy he can generate with only his feet.
If I had a time machine, I would totally enter him and Suh (at age 25 each) in a body building competition, where everything from muscle definition to pure weight lifting ability would be considered.
by bearded thundar on May 26, 2010 5:03 PM EDT up reply actions
The family joules
"The Lakers were favored 8 to 1 odds to beat the Pistons. Bullshit." - Bill Davidson, Championship parade, 2004
I fucking worship Ben Wallace
"The Lakers were favored 8 to 1 odds to beat the Pistons. Bullshit." - Bill Davidson, Championship parade, 2004
by Skylar on May 26, 2010 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Apples and Oranges
You can’t compare shoeless heights measured at the combine with NBA listed heights. If you do, you should add about 2 inches to the combine measurement to get even close.
Dwight Howard and Emeka Okafor both measured 6’9" without shoes.
Ben Wallace is probably 6’7" without shoes, at the most. That’s what makes him such a wonderful freak.
I must admit I am happy to hear Joe wants the D back in Detroit
He misjudged last year, but at least he now sees where he fucked up. Hopefully he means it. Maybe BG and CV play better next season. It all hinges on the front court, whether improved through the draft, trade, or both.
/riding the rainbow
Well, there was the bit that you missed where I distracted him with the cuddly monkey then I said "play time's over" and I hit him in the head with the peace lily.
Feels good man.
"The Lakers were favored 8 to 1 odds to beat the Pistons. Bullshit." - Bill Davidson, Championship parade, 2004
Do tell
It reaffirmed what Dumars thinks are the ultimate keys to winning — grit and toughness.
“What I didn’t like was the way we played this year,” he said. "What I didn’t like was the lack of toughness this year.
“We had some slippage in terms of the toughness and grit that we’ve had for the last 10 years. We drifted some from what we were when we were successful.”
Confusing statement, given that he brought in two players last year that were not known AT ALL for their “grit” or “toughness”, but were pretty much known for scoring points and not much else.
I’m glad to hear that Dumars thinks last season was a learning experience, but it is frustrating to me that Dumars apparently had a brain fart the one year he actually had money to spend.
If this was a temporary problem, it was a bad fucking time to have it.
by Big Z in Orlando on May 27, 2010 3:48 PM EDT reply actions
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