Greg Monroe and Jonas Jerebko make history: rare frontcourt dominance
by Mike Payne on Jan 1, 2012 2:10 AM EST
in Detroit Pistons News
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PrintFor a Detroit Pistons team so desperate for frontcourt help, tonight's game against the Pacers was a rare showing of dominance. Greg Monroe recorded 19 points, 11 rebounds, 4 assists and a block, while Jonas Jerebko put up 20 points and 12 rebounds with stellar shooting from downtown. To call such a combined effort "rare" is an understatement, as such an occurrence has happened three times in Detroit Pistons franchise history.
After poring over the box score tonight, post New Year's celebration, I wondered how rare it is for Detroit to have a pair of frontcourt players that both put up at least 19 and 11. There's no easy way to answer such a question, so I dug through a lot of data on the Pistons history. After plenty of research, I found that only two other players in Pistons history have put up at least 19 points and 11 rebounds in a single game-- Bill Laimbeer and Rick Mahorn. Twice in their careers, Laimbeer and Mahorn did what Jonas and Greg did tonight.
On December 8th, 1987, Rick Mahorn put up 20 points and 20 rebounds next to Bill Laimbeer, who scored 30 points and 14 rebounds. Over a month later, on January 22nd, 1988, Mahorn put up 19 points and 12 rebounds while Laimbeer recorded 21 and 14. And for the third time in franchise history, Monroe and Jerebko joined these Pistons greats with one of the three most collectively dominant frontcourt games Detroit fans have ever seen.
In short, this type of game doesn't happen every day. It's been nearly 24 years since the last time a pair of Pistons put up 19 and 11 or more from the starting frontcourt. For a team that so direly needs help up front, this is a welcome sign that all of us should celebrate. Hey, it's not like you're busy celebrating anything else...
Oh yeah, Happy New Year!!
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amazing
and Knight in his 2nd game did something Chauncey didn’t do until his 8th NBA season and Isiah never did. The future is bright?
The future is bright?
Honestly, as bad as this team is and will be for a while, the rarity of the talent we already do have is unreal. The future can be very bright if we can undo the mistakes we’ve had in free agency for, well, years.
yea i'm liking the core though
jonas, monroe, knight and i still have some faith left for stuckey… hopefully daye can also get it going in the reg season
More Fun With Numbers
since Detroit’s last championship, we’ve only rebounded this well 11 times in regulation play. And in the last five years, we’ve only rebounded better than this 3 times.
謹賀新年
明けましておめでとうございます。
本年もどうぞよろしくお願い致します。
And Happy First Win for Pistons! I watched the game from 2nd quarter,
and then Monroe dominate in the paint. Also JJ played so hard.
I think CV must be traded for some sort of the big body for 3-big rotation.
We need another big instead of Big Ben ( no offense for him).
Where broken English happens
by OK from J on Jan 1, 2012 3:16 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
Just Think
That JJ and Moose did this playing outside of their natural positions. Put a real C in that front line to join them, and watch them really flourish.
This is DBB, and this is what we do.
by V. on Jan 1, 2012 4:15 AM EST reply actions 10 recs
right!
And I didnt think I’d ever say this – but I kind of like Joe being patient and ‘passively’ tanking by not making any big moves, and building thru the draft. With so many quality bigs in this draft, its only a matter of time before we contend.
We have so many C options: All of them are either skilled,athletic, or both, none of them are undersized PFs, and at least One of them is guaranteed to be available.
Drummond
Davis
Meyers leonard
Cody zeller
steven adams
Lots of guards to tempt Joe too, however.
by freywagg on Jan 1, 2012 12:38 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
I Think That Starts Happening Next Year
JJ really should be the starting 3 now.
Get back to me in 20 games or so, and I’ll let you know about how bright the future is here. Mostly depends on how well Knight develops, and I’m optimistic. He is doing ok IMHO, and he’s very young and very raw-again, IMO ahead of the curve.
This is DBB, and this is what we do.
by V. on Jan 2, 2012 4:26 AM EST up reply actions
From the days of the badboys
Hope we have many more!!!
all i wanted for christmas has to wait for another year
by alaskanpistonsfan on Jan 1, 2012 5:31 AM EST reply actions
Crazy happy that Moose is on my DBB team!
Frank saying that Jonas hit his shots in the flow of the offense is encouraging, too. Honestly didn’t anticipate that they would actually be calling plays for him. The fact that I missed the second half sucks!
What's a hundred million between friends? Make a deal and let's get on with it.
by BandWagonerPaysTheDues on Jan 1, 2012 7:01 AM EST reply actions
Happy New Year, Everyone!
Here’s to a great season of game threads!
In the coming year, I wish all of you success in your actual lives!
A season of great game threads is always a given
Happy New and Prosperous Year to all
all i wanted for christmas has to wait for another year
by alaskanpistonsfan on Jan 1, 2012 10:54 AM EST up reply actions
Monroe should have that expression since the moment he steps into the court
until the moment he steps off.
WWGMD?
Who was that guy who was trying to decide whether they should start Knight or Jerebko
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
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So.....I know I've made the Dirk comparison to Jonas as a barometer for success in this year...
and I realize that it is well absolute best case scenario. That said:
1st Year:
Jerebko – 9.3 points, 6 boards, 0.7 assist, 1.0 steals, 7.5 FGA, 48% FG, 31% 3PT
Nowitzki – 8.2 points, 3.4 boards, 1 assist, 0.6 steals, 7.1 FGA, 40% FG, 21% 3PT
2nd Year:
Jerebko – 13.8 points, 7 boards, 0.7 assists, 1 steals, 10.3 FGA, 54% FG, 50% 3PT
Nowitzki – 17.5 points, 6.5 boards, 2.5 assists, 0.8 steals, 13.6 FGA, 46% FG, 38% 3PT
Of course, its small sample size so far from JJ, but regardless, I think this will be my favorite story to follow this year. Of course, they won’t ever be the same player since JJ scores away from the ball while Dirk gets most of his points creating for himself but same positions, same build, both fair-haired and European.
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
Love Beer? Me too! http://jimbobsbeerblog.wordpress.com/
Follow me on twitter: #JimBobsBeerBlog
I’d just hope Jonas develops defensively faster than Dirk did. It took him 5+ years to become even an average defender. IME, if Jonas can cover most 3’s and 4’s, but scores a little less, that’s a win.
Will argue against trading #45 until I am blue in the face and your eyes and ears are bleeding.
by SpursfanSteve on Jan 1, 2012 1:38 PM EST up reply actions
yeah exactly. AK-47 is probably a better comparison skill set-wise...
but if a 2nd round draft pick like JJ turns into either one of those players, its a huge win.
Also, I think JJ already has a better feel for defense even if his D-Rating doesn’t show it. The way he frustrated the fuck out of David West last night was brilliant.
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
Love Beer? Me too! http://jimbobsbeerblog.wordpress.com/
Follow me on twitter: #JimBobsBeerBlog
My thought is Gerald Wallace
Energy, rebounding, inside/outside/hustle offense, and can effectively defend a 3 or 4.
oh good call.
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
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Wallace is a better athlete (much stronger as well)
My choice between the two would really depend on who you put around them. Jonas will likely be a very solid 3 point shooter and great as a complimentary piece for most contenders (especially Orlando), but I would take Wallace for any team that lacks a true inside presence (like ours)
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 2:25 PM EST up reply actions
I think JJ will continue to develop an inside presence...
but we may not need him to if we get someone like Sullinger in the draft allowing us to push JJ to the 3.
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
Love Beer? Me too! http://jimbobsbeerblog.wordpress.com/
Follow me on twitter: #JimBobsBeerBlog
I personally don't want him to
His frame is pretty well filled out as it is; I can’t see him adding enough additional mass to hang out in the low post without it really hampering the lateral speed advantages he has at his height (which I find to be his most valuable asset)
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 2:56 PM EST up reply actions
He seemed to handle himself quite well against West last night
at 6’10" and 240 pounds, I wouldn’t want him to add much more either unless it was a bit of mass in his lower body so he didn’t have to use his upper body so much banging inside.
But agreed that I’d rather have lateral movement over 5 more pounds of lower body strength.
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
Love Beer? Me too! http://jimbobsbeerblog.wordpress.com/
Follow me on twitter: #JimBobsBeerBlog
West is a high post jumpshooter though
I’d rather just draft a center and keep him at the 3 where has a size advantage, than try to mold him into a 4
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 3:34 PM EST up reply actions
here's a draft question
Do we want a super athletic defensive minded big that will allow us to slot Monroe at the 4 and Jonas at the 3 or do we want a 4 who can fill it and rebound that we can play alongside Monroe but might leave us slightly exposed on the defensive end of the floor? I go back and forth and think an argument can be made either way.
by Other Matt on Jan 1, 2012 3:49 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I prefer the former.
Greg Monroe is developing his game in a way that he can be the hub of the Pistons low/high post offense. I think the Pistons will become more of a well rounded team with a long. athletic defensive-minded big whom he can pair up with. At this point that guy would only have to be taught and coached up to catch passes cleanly and finish strong on the offensive end.
I’d want a versatile athletic defensive blocks and dunks guy that can guard the 4 or 5. basically I want Ben Wallace in his prime or Kevin Garnett, but wanting players that only come around once a generation seems pointless. A good weak side guy that can come swat some shots would be fine. We need blocks. And dunks.
by mcflies on Jan 1, 2012 4:22 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
Blocks and dunks!
Amen. I’ll co-sign that comment in bold.
Funny story
There’s this guy from Kentucky whose bread and butter is blocks and dunks and who frequently gets compared to Garnett…
How's that for a slice of fried gold?
by Thom not Tom Gores on Jan 1, 2012 4:55 PM EST up reply actions
looks like he's smelling something real bad
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 5:59 PM EST up reply actions
that dude is really muppetty looking. i hear he’s a beast on D though, i havent seen any of KU’s games this year. Is he as impressive as people are saying?
follow me on twitter: @danieldresden
by dandresden on Jan 1, 2012 6:18 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
i haven't had time to follow the ncaa this year
I’ll check them out next time I see they’re on
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 6:24 PM EST up reply actions
Davis of KY
He’s averaging about 12 pts, 10 boards, and 4.5 blocks a game. Against Louisville, he hit 12 of 13 FTs, had 18 pts, 10 rebounds, 6 blocks, 3 steals. Not bad …
Yeah, he does
The IU game was probably his worse – in 24 min. he had 6 pts, 9 boards, 3 blocks and 3 steals. NBADraft.net rates him the 3rd best prospect.
Did you see the free throws?
I’m wondering if he just got really lucky one game, or if he’s actually a solid shooter as well
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 6:42 PM EST up reply actions
Free throws
He’s had some other good shooting games, but also a few poor ones. The story is that he was a 6-3 guard as a HS junior and then shot up 7 inches. I just like any guy who focuses on rebounding and defense, and clearly he does.
agreed on the rebounding and defense
But at the same time you don’t want to have a guy who just gets hack-a-shaq’d at the end of every close game because he can’t hit his free throws. It would be a definite plus if he can average 70-80%
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 6:48 PM EST up reply actions
that would be nice
buts its not a deal breaker for me. if he plays hard nose d and is adequate offensively thats more than enough for me. looks kinda slim though, is he a NBA center physically?
follow me on twitter: @danieldresden
hard to say from his photos alone
I would like him to add a good 20 pounds, but if he can hold his own then that’s all that matters
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 6:52 PM EST up reply actions
He's only about 220 ...
So I don’t know if he’s center material. Since he’s just a freshman, we don’t how much more he might fill out. But he’s the type of guy who could potentially complement Monroe well up front.
it would be nice to slide moose back to the 4 but if this guy can play like this at the 4 in the nba then i could live with keeping monroe at the 5 spot.
follow me on twitter: @danieldresden
I think Monroe can hold his own against most centers
Having a guy who is incredibly athletic and can block shots alongside him would work well, I think. And with JJ at the 3, that’s a big frontline
I don't think Moose necessarily has to play the 4
The guy holds his own in the low post for the most part. He really needs a guy to help him box out though. I think as long as you shift JJ back to the 3, it doesn’t really matter between him and (Davis) who plays what
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 6:56 PM EST up reply actions
What's That Insect Between His Eyes?
This is DBB, and this is what we do.
by V. on Jan 2, 2012 4:28 AM EST up reply actions
I agree that Wallace is more explosive, but I think Jonas is the stronger
As you mentioned below, Jonas is pretty filled out – seeing him in person the other day, he looks awful darn strong. Wallace has always seemed on the strong-but-thin side.
As between the two, I dunno who I’d prefer – I’m just awful happy to have a 24 year old fella who compares somewhat to Gerald Wallace.
It's not just about size
Genetics play a huge role in strength. The slightest differences in tendon length and muscle fiber density are what separate guys like Verlander and KG from the rest of the pack. In terms of bulk they’re both pretty unimposing, but still one guys throws 100+ mph consistently and the other has guarded Dwight Howard successfully.
You look at just how explosive Wallace is and you easily tell he’s got some very special genetics. I don’t know what the numbers are, but I’ve seen him guard centers from time to time and be perfectly fine. Jonas on the other hand still gets pushed around a bit. I don’t think that’s an indictment on Jonas and his weight training routine; if anything that just speaks to just how gifted Wallace is.
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 6:05 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I, for one, love the BT physiology posts.
I really enjoy reading about things that are total mysteries to me explained in a really clear way.
(Now care to take a stab at the Prince re-signing, BT?…;-)
My blogs: pakagankarachi.livejournal.com (dormant)
burmahunkalove.livejournal.com (occasional signs of life)
by MrHappyMushroom on Jan 2, 2012 8:16 AM EST up reply actions
haha much appreciated
I think we’d need a magic crystal ball for that one though
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 2, 2012 9:56 AM EST up reply actions
Jerebko Defensively
I know that what I’m about to say is based on flimsy evidence, but I went to see the Pistons and Sixers at Philly in his rookie year and came away super impressed with his defensive work in that game. He played next to Ben for the most part and watching the two of them work on Philly’s front court gave me hope for him. His footwork and quickness were really noticeable. I thought he did a lot of little things that don’t show up in the box score.
by Other Matt on Jan 1, 2012 3:44 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I didn't watch the game
But seeing the starting 5 all comfortably in double digits is nice. We’re not necessarily going to be fighting for a playoff spot but i do think we’ll be a fun team to watch. That’s good enough for me. Altho I am wondering how Frank is going to deal with CV when he comes back.
See i told you...
we’d do better when Charlie V was done with his suspension…this game was ALL Charlie V!!!!! …but seriously, good game boys.
by CheerstoLilWayne on Jan 1, 2012 5:55 PM EST reply actions
The Lions game was mind blowing
They definitely got jobbed by the refs (the NFL needs to seriously consider redoing their challenge policy), but holy shit did Stafford and Megatron make some amazing plays. Unfortunately, once again our secondary got picked apart…. Definitely a very worthwhile watch
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
It sure was!
Brandon McDonald has to make pick on that ball that went through both of his hands. If he catches that errant throw from Matt Flynn then the game is over with the Lions on top.
The refs did make quite a few questionable ticky-tack calls that went against the Lions though. Plus there were a bunch of non-calls of blatant violations that the Packers had as well. I’m still in disbelief that the Lions d-line hadn’t drawn one single holding call on that offensive line all game. I saw a few instances where there was literally a takedown of Kyle Vanden Bosch in some passing situations.
Anyway, I think the with key guys on defense like Corey Williams, Louis Delmas and possibly Nick Fairley returning, the Lions have a decent shot at beating the Saints next week on a fairly called game. However, that’s the problem in of itself because they may get horribly shafted by the refs like what happened during that Sunday night game a few weeks back. Those deliberate non-calls on obvious violations that contribute to big plays for the opponent are big morale breakers.
What Are You Talking About?
/s The 2001-02Sac Kings
This is DBB, and this is what we do.
by V. on Jan 2, 2012 4:30 AM EST up reply actions
Lions got robbed of a TD and more
But you can’t give up 45 points and 6 TD passes to a backup QB. Sad, because I think they could have beaten Dallas or the Giants, but I honestly don’t think they have much of a chance against the Saints in New Orleans.
The Lions have a decent chance to beat any team with the offense they have. To beat the Saints, however, they’ll have to get extra possessions somehow… like force a few turnovers and get some lucky bounces. Getting consistent inside pressure is the key to slowing Drew Brees and the Saints offense, and the Lions have the defensive tackles up front who can do just that. Nick Fairley was dominating that regular season game against them before he had to come out. Both he and Suh — who didn’t play in that game at all — are going to cause some havoc out there.
Hope so, but
Not a lot of pressure on the QB yesterday. And at some point, teams might really game-plan for the fact that Detroit can’t run. But still, I’m excited they made the playoffs.
You gotta stop Sproles.
He’s been a giant-killer since his college days. Ask any Sooner…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q4PsgXbvTuU
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by MrHappyMushroom on Jan 2, 2012 8:23 AM EST up reply actions
Sure, but the Saints have the best interior offensive linemen in the league. It won’t be easy for Suh and Fairley.
Just means Avril and Vandenbosch need to pick it up.
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
Love Beer? Me too! http://jimbobsbeerblog.wordpress.com/
Follow me on twitter: #JimBobsBeerBlog
Maybe Brees will get cocky?
And think he can throw with his eyes closed against our secondary. But maybe our DBs will step it up like they did against the Chargers. Could they have subtly relaxed because they weren’t playing against Rodgers? It’s hard to believe that the Pack’s backup QB is truly that good …
yikes! Cousins is demanding a trade from Sacramento
pretty glad we didnt end up with that headcase.
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Let's send them Tay!
He’s great with helping young point guards run offenses, can operate in the post AND BLOCKED REGGIE MILLER!
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 6:43 PM EST up reply actions
He's still incredibly talented though
If he’s on the market, I would at the very least inquire about the price
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 6:53 PM EST up reply actions
the pistons locker room is probably not the best situation to bring this guy into. im cool with not going after him. let team moral improve to a more solid level before introducing a locker room cancer to it.
follow me on twitter: @danieldresden
I don't know what he's complaining about
He’s getting tons of touches out there. If anything he’s shooting too much
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 7:03 PM EST up reply actions
maybe the other blackholes on the blackholiest team in the NBA are taking too many away from him. maybe jimmer tried to convert him to mormonism. who knows.
follow me on twitter: @danieldresden
Serves them right
Fuck Sacremento with a Tom Cruise butt plug
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 7:06 PM EST up reply actions
yeah that team is pretty all over the place, pretty lame how they tried to move to LA last year. think that deal has gotta be dead with the clips being reinvigorated now.
follow me on twitter: @danieldresden
I hate everything about their management/ownership
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 7:09 PM EST up reply actions
someone on twitter said that they think 2 second rounders and a rotation guy is about all they would give up for cousins. if that was the price i would be okay with it as long as its not JJ, Moose or Knight.
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I would still offer Tay
Veteran leadership!!!!!!!
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 7:08 PM EST up reply actions
if SAC took tay and 2 2nd rounders that would be worth a try
they would have to be buffoons to take that deal.
follow me on twitter: @danieldresden
he's got nearly zero trade value because of the announcement
I would also argue that Tay is a better team player than Salmons
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 7:11 PM EST up reply actions
salmons is pretty terrible so yeah i agree, tay would be an upgrade.
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He's had a few really good years
But seems that for every good one, he’s got 2 bad. That and he just scores, doesn’t do much of anything else
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 7:18 PM EST up reply actions
and he's not really good at that either.
he seems to think he’s dwayne wade or something.
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maxiell works
i don’t think we can trade tay because we’ve just signed him. Sign and trades are only valid within 48 hours of the signing. After that we have to wait 3 months before we can move him.
www.twitter.com/frikshun
Art Williams don't care about logic
You just do it.
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 7:39 PM EST up reply actions
Sure you're right about that
I just don’t know that Cousins is worth the headaches he’d cause. Do we really want another guy taking bad shots?
If we find a way to trade Tay for him
It would fix our rotation while still giving us the possibility of winning the lottery if he doesn’t pan out
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 7:41 PM EST up reply actions
There may be an earlier date we can trade tay
Normally it’s 3 months or dec 15th. Whichever comes later. But because of the shortened season and very late free agency they may have changed that rule for this season.
www.twitter.com/frikshun
yeah...only problem is when we trade for him
and he insists on getting his 15 shots a night when he’s only hitting on 32%…
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
Love Beer? Me too! http://jimbobsbeerblog.wordpress.com/
Follow me on twitter: #JimBobsBeerBlog
You absolutely try to make that trade
Put your top three young guys and next year’s first rounder off limits. If the Kings would do any other combo, why not?
Look, this team needs big. As of now, there is little to no chemistry. It’s not like the season is on the line. A nice win against the Pacers aside, this is probably a 20-30 win team.
Who knows—maybe Sac really is a fucked place to play? People have been desperate for that Fresenko guy; you definitely take a flyer on DMC. And if he’s just plain a selfish headcase, you invent an AI back injury and reboot next year.
That said, I don’t see Sacramento wanting anything other than Monroe, JJ, or Knight. #s 1 & 3 are out of the question. Think Jerebko could be moved for someone like Cousins? Who’s more likely to become an All-Star—a second year star who’s started badly or a late middle rounder who’s exceeded all expectations?
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by MrHappyMushroom on Jan 2, 2012 8:40 AM EST up reply actions
He doesn't impress enough to make me want to trade for him.
and the last thing that Frank needs as he establishes himself is some dumb ass challenging his authority.
You think Frank couldn't handle Cousins?
Frank has been to prison, man. That mofo won’t put up with no shit and, on many occasions, I’ve heard him say he ain’t scared to go back.
(I may or may not be correct about the prison thing.)
by TDP on Jan 2, 2012 9:48 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
What about Ben Wallace though
He was our plan with Q for Cousins, and Frank is a much better coach than John Koostis
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 2, 2012 9:59 AM EST up reply actions
I still don't like it...
even with Wallace. I think he just ends up being more hassle than he’s worth.
pistonspowered says the Pistons are still very interested
The thing that struck me the most was the update at the bottom. Apparently Cousins’ agent is denying the trade demand (which I guess makes sense from a fines perspective), but it still seems very strange for the coach to make this public. As I said earlier, that move instantly killed a lot of his trade value. I doubt any team is willing to pay market value now, they’ve probably already received a lot of low ball offers from other GMs
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 2, 2012 9:58 AM EST up reply actions
yeah...I'd consider offering them a protected 2012 draft pick....say Top 10 protected in 2012
Top 5 protected in 2013, Top 3 protected in 2014. I’d also offer them Daye + CV for Cousins and Garcia.
If we assume that the addition of Cousins/subtraction of Daye and CV would push us into playoff contention, we’d likely be giving up this year’s lottery pick in a very deep draft. That is a lot of value for Cousins who in this particular draft would still likely be a top 10. CV and Daye would give them some value and I’d much rather have Garcia than Daye at this point, even if he still has 2 years left on his contract.
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
Love Beer? Me too! http://jimbobsbeerblog.wordpress.com/
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I would take back as minimal as possible
Ideally we swing the deal at the trade deadline just so that we still tank enough for a top pick, but then would be able to also include Tay into the deal. Even if we got Cousins, I would still want a top tier shot blocker
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 2, 2012 4:27 PM EST up reply actions
Agreed.
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
Love Beer? Me too! http://jimbobsbeerblog.wordpress.com/
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Not to mention
The longer he sits at home, the lower his trade value becomes. If he’s available at that point, he could probably be had for nothing
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 2, 2012 4:41 PM EST up reply actions
truehoop (espn)
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 7:03 PM EST up reply actions
Salaries Don't Match, Either
This is DBB, and this is what we do.
by V. on Jan 2, 2012 4:31 AM EST up reply actions
don't have to
Sacremento is under the cap. The big thing is they’re broke, so that’s probably the reason why they reportedly want 2 seconds instead of a first
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 2, 2012 10:00 AM EST up reply actions
Thanks for the link!
Gosh, that sounds crazy! Makes our problems last year sound mild. But if they make a serious attempt to trade him, I’m sure someone will bite. Drafting Monroe is looking better all the time …
thats what i think every time i watch DMC play or read about him. Monroe is already better than he is, at least according to the eyeball test, pretty sure the stats would show that too.
follow me on twitter: @danieldresden
I would say Cousins is more talented
But Monroe is definitely the better player for other reasons
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 7:11 PM EST up reply actions
Bet they wish they'd signed Dalembert now!
They basically handed him a starting job. Athletically, he’s got more raw ability than Monroe. He could be a special player, but his head’s not right. Monroe is light years ahead of him in mental approach to the game.
Stats
If you look at pts, rebs, blocks, Cousins looks pretty good. But the shooting percentage is what stands out as awful. He’s shooting 32 % on FGs through 4 games!
thats terrible for any position but especially for a C
is he not getting good looks at the rim?
follow me on twitter: @danieldresden
he wants to be a high post jump shooter
And he’s got Rodney’s shot selection
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 7:25 PM EST up reply actions
I think that's right
At KY he was a beast inside – Shaq-like. But I recall that when he worked out for the Kings, they talked about his jump shooting. Maybe he fancies himself as the second coming of CV …
let's do it
CV and 2 seconds for Cousins
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 7:29 PM EST up reply actions
it wouldn't be a bad deal
It would save us the cost of amnestying him
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 1, 2012 7:34 PM EST up reply actions
If Joe D made us experiment with two knuckle heads with no future
He should at least try and turn around this knucklehead with a future. At least this guy is on a rookie contract and can be gone shortly. I think since we are doing them a favor, they should take Max and call it a day.
Welcome... to the Wallace-hood
Good plan, but...
the problem is that the Kings already signed a try-hard undersized forward (Chuck Hayes) to a 4-year, $23M contract just before this season started. I find it hard to believe that this club would want another one who isn’t nearly as productive as the one they just acquired.
agreed
if the Kings trade Cousins, they’re likely to find value in return. There are potentially a decent number of teams that would want to get involved here, and competing bids should drive his price beyond what we could afford. The only pieces we have that we’d want to trade are either really expensive, really bad or not needed.
If the Pistons were to get involved, it might take a 3rd team to get Sacramento the bigs it would need in return. Something like this (ignore the w/l numbers, they are off-balance because three of the involved players haven’t yet played this season. also, i’d expect both Detroit and Philly to toss in a 2nd rounder, possibly Detroit sending an additional second to Philly)
by Mike Payne on Jan 1, 2012 8:28 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I watched the Kings when they played the Blazers and most of the second hall vs. the Bulls (also might watch them tonight against the Clippers if the Cowboys vs. Giants NFL game turns out to be a dud), and it appeared to me that the team has no clear identity as to what they want to run offensively. I’d say they do a lot of ehh… weird things. Seems like a really undisciplined bunch to me on the break and in the halfcourt. I say that because there’s been many instances during Kings games where a player clearly doesn’t make a smart decision when taking a shot depending on being in an unfavorable matchup, selfishness, didn’t see or just plain ignored open teammate, being out of range/comfort zone, etc. Maybe the blame can be put into coaching, or maybe the blame falls into the players not listening coach Paul Westphal… I don’t know.
As for DeMarcus Cousins, I really liked him coming out of UK and I hope the Pistons would still inquire about him if he’s on the trading block because I think it’s just a situation where a change of scenery would do him a world of good. All I know is that the same stuff Cousins is getting criticized for, Rasheed Wallace got it ten times worse. I firmly believe Cousins would fall in line under strong locker room leadership like Sheed had coming to Detroit.
Monroe and JJ make up most of the value that can be scavenged from this team
I hope I’m not considered a fair-weather fan for join DBB after we finally win a game… I love a rebuilding project!
We have our man. It's Stafford. It's Suh. It's Calvin. It's Delmas. What we need is Man Number Two to stand up.
by halfbackattack33 on Jan 1, 2012 8:41 PM EST reply actions
In other news
DJ white is having a good game. He would offer a lot of what we need….
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
He's got nothing on Walter Sharpe!
Don’t you know ANYTHING?!!!!!!!
My blogs: pakagankarachi.livejournal.com (dormant)
burmahunkalove.livejournal.com (occasional signs of life)
by MrHappyMushroom on Jan 2, 2012 8:42 AM EST up reply actions
Pau and Bynum each have double-doubles and more points than Kobe
Meanwhile, Kobe is 6-27, 2 more shots than the two of them combined. Clearly, he is the greatest player of all time.
I wrote a book about time travel. Buy it and/or die. http://www.thetimetravelguide.com
Cousins’ agent John Greig said there was no trade demand to Sports Illustrated’s Sam Amick:
"DeMarcus never demanded a trade. I’m surprised the Kings, if they believe the player wanted… a trade, wouldn’t have made a phone call to his representative. Maybe Westphal is just feeling the heat early this season."
posturing
Westphal said the organization had his back in his statement. If that was a lie, he’d be sealing his fate as coach. Now Cousins’ agent is trying to put this pressure on Westphal instead. Dick move, John Greig. The right thing to do for his client, but a dick move.
The whole situation seems a bit iffy to me.
The coach making the announcement on behalf of the organization and a second-year player making a trade demand. The agent appears to have made some other comments that attempt to undermine the Kings.
Just wild, wild stuff.
by TDP on Jan 2, 2012 1:29 AM EST up reply actions
I Dunno
Westphal’s a fellow ‘SC alum, and DMC is an idiot. Guess who I’m backing lol?
This is DBB, and this is what we do.
by V. on Jan 2, 2012 4:33 AM EST up reply actions
I just don't get it.
Why would the organization allow the head coach to make such a public statement on such an issue when there’s reportedly been no formal trade request. Is the entire organization on board with Westphal’s sentiments? Why such a snide, exclamatory opening line to his announcement?
“Whenever a new season begins, in any sport, there is great hope that everything will progress in only a steady, upward direction. As we all know, it seldom happens like that in this life!”
To me, it doesn’t make sense for a coach and/or organization to publicly proclaim that a young player wants out. I gather that we don’t have the whole story and I’m partial to the idea that either the Kings, Westphal or both are purposefully providing misleading information about the circumstances. Every one knows that DMC is a headcase, but putting stuff out like this accomplishes nothing for the team, does it? They make Cousins look like a fool to the fans? Other GMs? I’m a bit confused about the end-game here. How does this do anything but diminish his trade value if that’s the goal? Or, if the intent is to get him to shape up, so to speak, how does this benefit an already strained coach-player relationship?
I’m done with rhetorical questions now. Vicodin keeps me awake.
by TDP on Jan 2, 2012 5:16 AM EST up reply actions
Vicodin Knocks Me Out
Its the Kings, one of the worst run franchises in the league. Nothing surprises me with them.
This is DBB, and this is what we do.
by V. on Jan 2, 2012 7:13 AM EST up reply actions
adding to the whole thing
I just looked into it, and the Westphal statements weren’t a comment to the press— they were an official press release by the Kings.
Geoff Petrie, the Kings president, said to the SacBee (which is an awesome name): “My intention is to meet with him today, this is really about putting away childish things”
So the organization is pretty much on record calling his attitude “childish”.
as you said:
How does this do anything but diminish his trade value if that’s the goal?
fucking precisely.
Maybe he's hinting at where he'd like to land based upon his Twitter pic
(The shirt isn’t the hint. No, not prison. He’s wearing a Red Wings hat.)
Unfortunately!
There is a rapper from Detroit, not named Em that Has kind of made it trendy to wear Wing regalia. Now, because he’s from the D (westside) Even tho’ the Eastside is the Beastsid!. I assume he is sincere in his efforts. But I must admit, Ever since he’s been on the scene I’ve been seeing various Detroit logo’s in some pussy ass places. These kids today are confusing. I look uon this as a fashion statement for him. Sheed wasn’t from Detroit. But when he wore that Wing Jersey,We knew he meant it. Now this here^^ I don’t know… I ant mad though.
Formerly known as SCNTFC!
I highly doubt it’s Danny Brown, because I don’t see too many kids dressing like anime superheroes and popping adderall…. wait just a fucking second.
WORD PLAY
hollywoodsloce.tumblr.com
by Biz Markie Moon on Jan 2, 2012 9:47 AM EST up reply actions
I was going to read The Da Vinci Code
but I never got around to it. Then the movie came out. And I didn’t watch that, either.
by TDP on Jan 2, 2012 5:04 PM EST up reply actions
my real name is actually Dan Braun (pronounced brown). imagine my shame.
follow me on twitter: @danieldresden
I feel your pain.
I legally changed my name – to the chagrin of the my family and the proud Butteliquer legacy.
by TDP on Jan 2, 2012 5:14 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
If You Want To Sound Like One Of The Local Cognoscienti
Refer to him as “Marshall” and to KR as “Bob”.
They’re both huge talents and great guys (latter FWIH).
Just sayin’..
This is DBB, and this is what we do.
by V. on Jan 3, 2012 12:32 AM EST up reply actions
Cousins isn't worth the asking price.
I would offer Max and two second rounders. That’s it. If they said no, oh well. We got our guy in Monroe already, maybe we get the next in the lottery.
I'm off to point the pink pistol at the porcelain firing range.
Cousins has 1 more guaranteed year
From there it’s just a team option and then the QO. If we can get him without trading a first, Monroe, Knight or JJ I don’t see why we shouldn’t be hounding their GM for him. Reportedly he came to training camp in good shape this year, perhaps a change of scenery is all he needs (and it helps that he wanted to come here).
If it doesn’t work out, we just have 1 more year of putting up with him. Worst come worst, we waive him and pay the full value (about $4 million). Odds are he would have at least a few suitors though, even Stephon Marbury stayed in the league for a deacde.
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 2, 2012 11:26 AM EST up reply actions
I'm gonna trade Cousins
To the Pistons on my NBA 2K12, win the title and disprove all of your theories on his helping the Pistons!
By the power of Grayskull... I have the power!
by He-Man on Jan 2, 2012 11:42 AM EST via mobile reply actions
Are you saying that
DMC is the fake like real like Bill Russell?
By the power of Grayskull... I have the power!
by He-Man on Jan 2, 2012 11:52 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I think people are also discounting Monroe as a leader
A lot of people are justifiably scared that Cousins will come in here and go Waka Flocka Thunderstomp all over our locker room. There’s a real possibility of that happening. With that being said, the odds of him poisoning anyone beyond CV, Daye, Tay and Stuckey are pretty slim. Seeing how it’s collectively agreed that we would be fine with Joe shipping out all of them, if they become cancers and force their way out, frankly I would be ok with that. Even in this scenario, we end up with another really high lottery pick to add to our core.
He’ll be competing with Moose for the starting center spot. I highly doubt that Frank would just hand Cousins minutes considering what we know of him. This what he had to say on the CV DNP-CD: “He’s fine,” said coach Lawrence Frank. “He’s dressed and ready to play but because he hasn’t had practice and played with us, I’m going to go with the guys who have a rhythm.” I believe in this guy. CV didn’t look good, so the coach didn’t allow him to play. Fair is fair.
Not having minutes will obviously frustrate the guy, but I think it’ll light a fire that Big Ben could control. Same way that Mark Aguire was pissed that Rodman took his minutes, and ended up working his tail off, I think over time he would actually look to Monroe for advice. You can already here Moose directing the defense at times; he’s making sure his voice will be heard. Through a combination of leading by example, and speaking up when appropriate, I think he would actually be a very strong influence on his own.
Then there’s JJ, Knight, Bynum, BG, Maxiell and even Macklin is reported to be a really good guy. I was really impressed when Knight would often deny people the ball (especially CV) when they were out of position. I was really impressed when JJ straight up told Daye the turnover was his fault and to stop complaining. And I’m willing to bet that behind closed doors Gordon is making an impact this year as well. You can tell from his demeanor on the court that he’s a lot happier and is really making an effort to win this year.
Sure we don’t have a group of veterans, but we still have a stronger core than people give us credit for. Getting rid of Rip was a huge move in the right direction, and now that Tay is happy he seems to be a positive influence as well again. If anything, I would say it would be a massive mistake to not make a play for him. His market value is as low as it will ever be, to think we could get a franchise center for virtually nothing would be the type of move people expected from the old Joe Dumars. This could be his chance at redeeming the AI trade, the Amir debacle, and some of the bizarre contracts he’s given out. As true piston fans, we believe in our team.. Let’s give them a shot to prove themselves.
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 2, 2012 11:54 AM EST reply actions
why would you assume Joe would ship them out if they became cancers?
they were cancers last year and he gave them long term deals. Cousins isnt what this team needs right now. too high maintenance.
follow me on twitter: @danieldresden
I don't know what happened with the Tay deal
But he got rid of Rip. He didn’t offer Sheed another contract. He didn’t bring back Tmac after the refusal to play ordeal. I think he sees a lot himself in Stuckey for some reason, so I don’t agree with the deal, but I understand where he’s coming from with that one.
You can’t say that he didn’t get rid of the guys he believed to be cancers. Reportedly even Tay is very happy this year and behaving well. I would agree with everyone that JJ should be starting in place of him, but so far no attitude problems.
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 2, 2012 12:29 PM EST up reply actions
So much speculation. You could write a novel with it.
In this compact season there isn’t much time for drama everyone is too busy ballin. Cousins is as said above wacka flocka and a worse player than Monroe. He would not take kindly sharing minutes with Maxiell and would demand a trade out of here too.
Ben Wallace doesn't like whiny big men
He wouldn’t tolerate Cousins throwing a fit over minutes if the guy doesn’t play hard. As I said, even if he does want out, we could easily give him that option. I saw an article talking about how Orlando should consider trading Dwight for a package centered around him if they can’t get any other deals they like. I would go as far as to say he’s more talented than Howard is (granted I have a soft spot for the guy), but he’s not nearly the athlete.
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 2, 2012 12:25 PM EST up reply actions
you're assuming JoD wouldn't just do Monroe for Cousins straight up
which is scary to think about. I wish he didn’t make me worry everyday, I have enough other shit to worry about.
I highly doubt he would ever do that
Joe showed that if anything he overvalues his young talent
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 2, 2012 12:21 PM EST up reply actions
"Waka Flocka Thunderstomp"?
Is that like Phi Slamma Jamma?
This is DBB, and this is what we do.
by V. on Jan 3, 2012 12:33 AM EST up reply actions
By the way for those who speculate why the coach would tell everyone what a head case Cousins is and ruin his trade value I think the simple explanation is that Westphal has had enough of Cousin whining at him and he basically said, “You think you are important? Let’s see how many teams want you if I tell them you’re a head case. Go ahead and try to get a trade now.”
Basically trying to get Cousins in line. It’s a last resort to do to a trouble making player, try to get him to behave and buy in and play hard by making it worthless for him to go anywhere else.
if that's true, seems like a weak minded coach to me
You lead by example, not by belittling people into behaving to your choosing
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 2, 2012 12:30 PM EST up reply actions
I think this was mentioned already but it was the team that released the statement...
which means it is likely the team that opted to word it the way they did.
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
Love Beer? Me too! http://jimbobsbeerblog.wordpress.com/
Follow me on twitter: #JimBobsBeerBlog
anyone up for obscure stats?
the Pistons are the only team in the NBA without a player on the roster that was acquired in a trade. Good job Joe.
by mcflies on Jan 2, 2012 12:56 PM EST reply actions 6 recs
Chunky was acquired in exchange for defense and rebounding
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 2, 2012 12:58 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I was going to write a FanPost about this
But I proved to be too lazy / otherwise busy. I’d say that about sums it up, though. rec’d
I wrote a book about time travel. Buy it and/or die. http://www.thetimetravelguide.com
can't believe I'm saying this, but the Wolves might be really good
Love is just exploding this year, they have a solid second line of bigs with the addition of Williams and Ricky Rubio doesn’t appear to suck. Softlps has averaged 7.5 assists off the bench so far, he + Love could be a lethal combination
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
I've been saying for a couple of years that they should be pretty good.
But they are always awful. I can’t figure it out. If high draft picks and stat stuffers led to championships, they’d be in the running. But they won 17 last year and are 0-3 this year. It’s perplexing. Far better roster than the Pistons, it seems…
My blogs: pakagankarachi.livejournal.com (dormant)
burmahunkalove.livejournal.com (occasional signs of life)
by MrHappyMushroom on Jan 2, 2012 4:51 PM EST up reply actions
I’ve been saying for a couple of years that they should be pretty good. But they are always awful. I can’t figure it out.
Likewise, I expected them to be much better than Detroit this season, given that they’re finally fielding an impressive roster beyond just Kevin Love. Rubio, Beasley, Williams, Love— you’d think they’d be able to put it together…
It's obvious they're lacking three major components of a championship team:
i.Team cohesion. ii. Proper game-time adjustments vis a vis iii. elite-level coaching. iv. Hubie Brown
by TDP on Jan 2, 2012 5:10 PM EST up reply actions 6 recs
I'm thinking they'll challenge for the 8 seed.
Will argue against trading #45 until I am blue in the face and your eyes and ears are bleeding.
by SpursfanSteve on Jan 4, 2012 10:34 AM EST up reply actions
The Wrong Cousins is having a big day
State just went into overtime
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
anddddddddd
He just proved why he’s the Wrong Cousins
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 2, 2012 4:47 PM EST up reply actions
gift from Georgia...
just tuned in after that pick…
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
Love Beer? Me too! http://jimbobsbeerblog.wordpress.com/
Follow me on twitter: #JimBobsBeerBlog
yeah Georgia blew it
State had no business winning that game. Their offense was awful in OT
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 2, 2012 5:20 PM EST up reply actions
Russell Wilson would be the ultimate backup to stafford
http://www.badgerbadgerbadger.com/
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
MUSHROOM MUSHROOM!
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
Love Beer? Me too! http://jimbobsbeerblog.wordpress.com/
Follow me on twitter: #JimBobsBeerBlog
Badgers are my second favorite Big10 team
They did us a massive favor in the championship game
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 2, 2012 6:07 PM EST up reply actions
A SNAKE ITS A SNAKE OHHHOHOHHHHHHH ITS A SNAKE!
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
Love Beer? Me too! http://jimbobsbeerblog.wordpress.com/
Follow me on twitter: #JimBobsBeerBlog
Montee Ball also looks like a Lion
I’m tired of Jahvid Best constantly being injured
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 2, 2012 7:15 PM EST up reply actions
holy shit
Dude just nearly jumped over a guy standing upright
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 2, 2012 7:16 PM EST up reply actions
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