Former Sixers center Marreese Speights was traded to Memphis earlier this week, which, of course, spurred a reaction from Pistons fans wondering why the team didn't get involved in trading for a big man who can score.
The Pistons were in talks with the Sixers, but the Sixers wanted draft picks and not actual players in return for Speights, who was traded for two second-round picks.
The Pistons like him but didn't want to give up picks while adding payroll.
5 months ago
Big Z in Orlando
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Ok Goodwill, that's nonsense
The idea of “the Pistons like him but didn’t want to give up picks while adding payroll” – seriously? Either way, you’re paying the players you take with those picks. Those two players will make nearly $900,000 – which means the additional payroll that Speights accounts for is less than $1 million.
I’m not a big fan of Speights, but if you have the opportunity to acquire a seven footer with proven NBA ability for second round picks, you do it.
you're not paying any 2nd round draft picks if you don't want to...
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plus the possibility of those picks adding value in a larger trade seems appealing...
that said, it would have been nice to have a legit big rotation even with Maxiell playing reasonably well
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
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Or perhaps we're just biding our time for Jarvis Varnado?
Really though, it’s not that hard to get a young big man these days. Spencer Hawes went to Philly for Dalembert’s expiring and two years of Nocioni’s bad contract. B.J. Mullens was a future 2nd round pick. Brandon Wright signed a 2 year deal for $1 million a year (the second year as a team freaking option).
Seriously, why don’t we just load the hell up on project big men and hope one of them pan out? Get Seraphin, get Varnado, get Aldrich, get Thabeet. Earl Clark’s a free agent coming back from China. Get him. Are you tall? Do you bebound? Sensurgency? Cheap? Done.
by Shinons* on Jan 7, 2012 5:29 PM EST up reply actions 7 recs
Good Analysis
It seems like the FO’s strategy here is to add a big in the draft next year. I can’t disagree with it.
This is DBB, and this is what we do.
by V. on Jan 7, 2012 7:37 PM EST up reply actions
Earl Clark plays the 3.
And I’m almost certain he already resigned with Orlando.
by TDP on Jan 8, 2012 10:33 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I wouldn't want him anyways
Not only does he play the 3, but he’s failed to make both the Magic and Suns rotation over guys like bionic powered Grant Hill and Turkey Glue. I’ll pass
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 8, 2012 10:50 AM EST up reply actions
See, this is exactly the opposite of what I'm wanting Jod to do
Chances are, all of those dudes I mentioned suck. But what’s the harm in bringing them in to get a look at them? It’s not like we’re exactly set at 3 anyways, and is Wilkins really the guy who should be getting big minutes on a floundering team?
Even though he’s failed to nail down a rotation spot, he’s proven that he can rebound in the NBA, that he’s got some potential on the defensive end (Van Gundy is talking about him as Orlando’s “defensive stopper” against the likes of Durant and James (iknowrite?), but still), and he’s still not yet 24 years old. Gimme as many guys like that as we can get. I don’t care were they been, I care about where they can go.
And TDP’s right, he did already re-sign with Orlando. At $2 million over 2 years? Yeah, there would have been no risk.
I don't think he's proven anything
Per minute numbers are pretty useless if the guy is playing under 15 minutes a game. I’m pretty sure he’s mainly played garbage time minutes anyways. If he was such a defensive talent he would be used as a situational guy.
I agree that we should be taking as many fliers as we can in hopes of one of them panning out, but I just don’t see any value in Earl Clark specifically. We should give Keith Benson a few tryouts (as far as I know he still is a free agent); at the very least he is big enough to give fouls at the 4 and possibly 5. Also I want to see Macklin play more when we’re down 20. The guy looks a bit clueless at times, but he sets really good screens and throws down some nice dunks.
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 8, 2012 12:22 PM EST up reply actions
Rebounds are generally regarded as the most readily translating stat
He was a real good rebounder in college, and is near that rate as a pro. It’d be one thing if we were looking at Amir, straight out of high school, but there’s three years of fairly significant minutes to look at here – and it’s in line with the pro per-minute numbers.
Maybe he isn’t any good – but presuming so just because he doesn’t currently get played is how solid players fall under the cracks. There are just way too many examples to count of guys changing teams, getting significant minutes, and thriving. Not saying that Clark would be one of them, but for $1 million a year for a 23 year old, it’d be worth finding out.
I agree with most of that
But you specifically said he’s proven he can rebound in the NBA, which I think is not the case. That would be like me proclaiming I am a proven author in medical science just because I’ve been working on one publication. Yeah it’s great that I’ve got something in the right direction, but have I proven anything yet? Absolutely not.
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 8, 2012 12:58 PM EST up reply actions
That's fine that you disagree, but I don't consider your comparison very accurate
Consistently putting up around 8 or more rebounds per 36 minutes for three years of solid minutes for a major college team, then two years of numbers trending following that same direction once he becomes a pro – five years of doing the same thing at a similar rate proves something to me. If you give me a lawyer that spent three years performing at a consistent level on law review, went and spent two years at a firm where with less time showed the same level of writing, I’d feel like I had a good grasp on their capability.
If you gave him 36 minutes per game, is there anything that realistically says he’s going to average fewer than four rebounds per game? That would require this number completely changing its direction. I think that’s very unlikely. For that reason, I feel totally comfortable considering his ability to rebound at the NBA level something that’s proven.
it couldn't have been primarily about money
Gores allowed Joe to buyout Rip, that’s like what the equivalent of 30 second round picks? I’m guessing the Pistons thought they could get a better player in this draft with a high second than Speights because its loaded with bigs
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 7, 2012 4:52 PM EST up reply actions
Right
Your guess is certainly possible. But the point is that Goodwill’s isn’t. I’m bitching more about the Detroit writers continuing to give Dumars passes. If they didn’t want Speights, fine – but the reasoning Goodwill is providing is completely illogical.
It also fails to mention it was a three team deal
What exactly are the rules about trading a player for picks? Are the picks assigned a monetary value based on how much the player would get? I’m just wondering since I believe we’re above the cap, which means we can’t just take on salary without giving something in return that is within 25% of the acquired player
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 7, 2012 5:12 PM EST up reply actions
50% of the acquired player...
that changed in the new CBA…makes trades a lot easier.
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
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I don't know if I like that change
It also makes it a lot easier to do Pau-Kwame type trades when teams are desperate for salary relief. I would say as a whole it should bring about a lot more quality trades, but you hate to be a fan on the team that trades a superstar just because they aren’t making enough money
Without a doubt, squats are a cure for everything.
by bearded thundar on Jan 7, 2012 5:28 PM EST up reply actions
Are the picks assigned a monetary value based on how much the player would get?
Yes, picks have a monetary amount called a cap hold toward the coming season. That amount is finalized when the drafted player signs a deal. Trading 2012 picks would not impact the Pistons current year salary profile. You’re right that we’re over the cap, which is why we can’t take Speights back without moving a player in return. Since the 76ers didn’t want that, they wouldn’t make the deal with us. It would have required a 3-team deal, and the one that went through included Memphis who took salary back in exchange for a second pick to Philly.
…I wish we could get two second round picks for Austin Daye.
by Mike Payne on Jan 7, 2012 5:23 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I Don't Know What Happened To Daye
…it’s like he suddenly forgot everything he knew about BB playing in Russia.
Maybe it’s a slump, and maybe he’ll come out of it, or maybe he’s just too skinny to play in the NBA.
I’ve always been of two minds about him; one side of my brain says he comes from a shitty, overrated program (Gonzaga) which is good at producing Turkish league talent but not much better, the other was impressed by his PER numbers and that he fell so low. In other words, he should be better than what he’s produced so far, but maybe it’s just an illusion.
This is DBB, and this is what we do.
by V. on Jan 7, 2012 7:41 PM EST up reply actions
the poor shooting is one thing with him.
watching him actually handle a basketball is another. He dribbles like I would dribble which leaves me impressed that he can run down the court and dribble a basketball at the same time. If he’s taking a shot, I don’t mind. That’s a funk that I think he’ll get himself out of. But to my untrained eyes, his ball handling is atrocious and if I see him do something besides shoot the basketball, than I get afraid.
your eyes aren't lying to you, poopz
I’m usually not one for the, “needs to get his read right,” argument, but in this case, it fits so well.
Dude has been a beast in pre-season as well as Summer League. Yes, that’s not real NBA basketball, but it’s basketball played against legitimate NBA talent — and
Daye looks like a completely different player
You’re right. This isn’t just a little shooting slump. It’s like a Jeckyl and Hyde thing going on. It’s gotta be something in his head. He second guesses literally every move he makes on the floor.
"With logic he attacks. With statistics he defends."
You are correct, sir
According to Vince Ellis at the FREEP, due to the Piston’s salary cap issues, and the 76’s unwillingness to take a player in return, this deal would have required a 3rd team.
Complicated, and not the slam dunk it would have appeared at first, but still disappointing that Joe D couldn’t make something happen.
by Big Z in Orlando on Jan 9, 2012 6:05 PM EST up reply actions
these freep guys are killing me lately
they seem to be on this thought process that the team is currently rebuilding, unofficially of course which is odd because we are capped out, but needed to sign stuckey since it would be foolish to let him walk and you cant just give him a QO and have him earn it because thats not how it works, that tayshaun will round back into shape and earn his contract, that yes this team is lacking bigs but thats not Joe’s fault because its impossible for any NBA team to get a big man and even if there was one available who do the pistons have to offer them? and thats not Joe D’s fault either.
basically their position is the roster is unbalanced, its not possible to trade for a big man with our shitty talent and none of it is Joe’s fault.
I read this stuff every day i just cant handle it. The problems with the team are because of moves Joe Dumars made but its not his fault. i cant understand how one arrives at that conclusion.
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If it's me involved...
its more of a
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
Love Beer? Me too! http://jimbobsbeerblog.wordpress.com/
Follow me on twitter: #JimBobsBeerBlog
by The Boourns on Jan 15, 2012 10:58 PM EST up reply actions
))<================>((
Jonas Jerebko once killed a charging female rhinoceros in heat protecting its young with nothing more than a hook shot.
Love Beer? Me too! http://jimbobsbeerblog.wordpress.com/
Follow me on twitter: #JimBobsBeerBlog
by The Boourns on Jan 15, 2012 10:58 PM EST up reply actions
Word
which is odd because we are capped out
This is what drives my absolutely insane.
The losing I can deal with. The pathetic play I can stomach with a view that at least we’re getting good picks.
But as afar as I’m concerned, the fact that this team is nestled comfortably against the salary cap and is easily one of the worst 5 teams in the league is both mind-boggling and infuriating.
Hey Joe Dumars! You should be rebuilding, not “retooling” Maybe if I send it to him on a cake, he’ll get the message.
by Big Z in Orlando on Jan 12, 2012 12:01 PM EST up reply actions
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