Look, I won’t lie. I’m not exactly throwing in the towel, but the Pistons haven’t done much to convince me that they can go on the road tonight against an opponent in their head and come out with a scheduled game on Monday. At this point, I’d consider “dignity intact” a lofty goal.
Yeah, I know. Not exactly Matt’s aforementioned “was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor” speech. Not the “once more unto the breach, dear friends” that Jazz fans or Warriors fans probably summoned in the face of their team’s dispatching. It is just much more fun being a fan of a team on the ascent, rather than one trying to muster one last ounce of fight. But for those of you who still need the glimmer, I’ll put it to you like this.
I love that speech.
Anyways, as I mentioned, I’m not in a ra-ra mood. But there is one thought that drives my fandom tonight. It isn’t the years that this team has had together and the potential breakup that could result from an embarrassing loss to a mediocre Cavs squad. It isn’t the potential discord between certain key (and, more importantly, untradeable) members and free-agent-could-be Chauncey Billups. It isn’t the fact that Flip Saunders will once again be proven a failure as a postseason coach. (It’s an effing trap off the pick and roll… how could you lose two games because of that?)
The thought that drives me, I’ll pretend you asked? Well, just think of the consequences of a loss tonight. Think about who stands to benefit from a loss tonight. Friends, I’m worried that Detroit is slipping below Cleveland on the sports loser scale. Seriously… think about it. The Tigs have proven themselves incapable of standing for the D (0-5 thus far against the Indians this season). Our beloved Wolverines… I don’t even want to talk about it. The Lions? How hard is it to be better than the Browns? Seriously…
But the Pistons. We’ve always been able to hang our hat on the Pistons. The balance of power is shifting dear friends. There is an angry, title-starved people on the banks of the Erie sludge pond, and they are rising up against us. They want what we have… mainly our consistently-slightly-better-than-mediocrity, and they won’t rest until our Pistons are on the slag heap.
Well, I say no. I say “Edgar Rentaria” on you. I say “Earnest Byner” on you. I say “Marcus Ray“, “Craig Ehlo“, and “John Cooper” upon you.
I say, “this is what happens when you ___ a stranger in the ___!” [WARNING: NSFW]
So it isn’t the perfect speech. Hell, I don’t even know if it’s applicable. But I’m in a weird place right now, and you should be too. Let’s get this b*tch over with, one way or the other. Game on.
[As always, leave your comments here.]
Any Given Sunday [YouTube.com]
Big Lebowski [YouTube.com]
Why do people talk like the Pistons are a dynasty or something? They’re just a really good team, and that’s what they’ve been the past five years.
Very well said. They have pulled one championship out of a large and long window. They are dynastic like the Atlanta Braves were.
…but, they are the best the East has had to offer over an extended period of time. So a dynasty? No. But one more win in ‘05 and they would be.
Two things come to mind.
1. Is Cleveland 1 rebound better than they were last year? Because that’s all they needed to win last year’s Game 6. Unfortunately, I don’t like the answer I come up with.
But, 2. How does Cleveland handle the EXPECTATION of winning, because everyone outside Detroit has already handed them the series, which really wasn’t as much the case last year. This year, it’s LeLeap. If they lose, it’s LeChoke.
Either way, given the 2-OT and McDyess’ ejection (and how fresh he should be), I’ll echo previous comments. If McDyess doesn’t have a monster game, it’s Cavs vs. Spurs. Because the only switch my Pistons will be flipping then will be on their TV sets to watch LeBron in the finals.
Lebron James father is obviously Rick James. I see some Super freak in the kid. Who would the mother be? I was thinking Dionne Warwick, or Tina Turner…but I think even in the 80’s they were too old. Any ideas on a mother from that era? Maybe Pee Wee Herman? Any help?
Just watched the DVD of 2004 Championship….. COME ON!!! Give me a chance to buy another!
nice start to the game. If it takes Larry Hughes hitting 3 pointers for CLE to win, I’ll give them the 2007 championship trophy myself.
Nazr? Nazr? Could it be more obvious that Flip will probably be coaching his last game tonight, as a piston
NOW’S the time you experiment with lineup changes, flip? this is IT. this is when you ride your starters into the f-ing ground. what the hell are you saving them for?
I don’t particularly think anyone looks good with a headband on, but Nazr looks especially stupid.
I thought a Giant Flip Murray came into the game. And what the hell is with these friggin’ malfunctions?
Hey what the heck happened? What’s with the delay?
Nice arena Cleveland.
It seems the first no-call that Webber didn’t get has him agitated. I hope it translates to points and some interior defense.
I think we need to post Tay up to get him going. He can rest some other night!
Let’s go Pistons!!
Two things
1) Nazr? Really? Let’s just send in Dupree in street clothes. Jesus Christ, Saunders, are you high?
2) Can I nominate Cleveland for the faultiest arena in the league? I know it’s hard make numbers count down sequentially and NOT have shit rain down on the players during a game but come on.
I REALLY hope this affects the Cavs and let’s us catch up.
Call me crazy but I think they are trying to get james some rest….
i really dont think these people know what theyre doing
Donyell Marshall is quickly becoming #1 on the list of “guys that are balding that shouldn’t wear cornrows list”. I don’t know if he’ll ever be able to beat Jerry Rice, but he does look ridiculous.
WTF!!!!! Mr Big Shot my ass!!!!!
Boney You are so right about Marshall! The rule should be if you had a high top fade you should not have cornrows because you are way to old for them…….
I can’t belive we may lose to these cats…. wow they suck… Whats wrong….
Theres no doubt they get foul calls easier than us…
I really am not a fan of Lindsey handling the ball at all. He can’t even throw an entry pass to the post [well, barely].
that’s three missed calls in a row. nice.
The calls are already becoming bullshit. One messed up charging and another messed up blocking… that’s a 5 point swing.
Hehe Gibson charges us and still gets the foul call for him? WTF? I guess the refs are going to do whatever they can to give the game to the CAVS
Sideshow Bob spends more time on his back then a ten dollar hooker.
no matter what team Varejao ever plays for, I will never respect his game. He is 6′10-6′11, about maybe 250lbs, and he falls down if you fart in his general direction.
like Chris Webber said in Game 5 Varejao got hacked to the floor “Rise up bitch”
With the season quite possibly coming to a close, I am getting extraordinarily drunk. I mean, out of my mind, drunk, stupid. Retarded. More drunk than last year when I saw them lose to the Heat in Game 6.
And, with the season ending, I must ask, while I am drunk and thinking about it…
Is Krista Jahnke hot? She has that little picture on her columns, but it’s hard to tell. Is she hot? Has anyone seen her?
Tech foul for what? These CAVS must be giving the refs one hell of the blowjob
Rob G: Never seen her. Find a bigger picture [for you and us].
Gibson is limping. Good sign for us, that means the refs won’t feel compelled to call even more crappy fouls.
I mean… I really respect her. She’s an excellent writer, and she seems to have the gift of sports writing. She’s “got a bright future” as that jackass Kerr said about Varejoke. Ah. I should not think about him while I drunk.
Rip got a tech for getting in Pavlovic’s face when Pavlovic didn’t agree with Webber shoving Varejao on a jump ball
You are typing VERY well while drunk. No typos… impressive.
I’ve worked hard on that. I have a master’s degree in English, which involves… getting drunk and typing.
Anyway, Krista’s probably married, anyway.
But is she hot?
Krista’s married to another writer for the Freep.
She is pretty cute too
I used to hate it when Chris Webber used to scowl, but that’s what we need tonight…
that and maybe a Piston or 2 giving the crowd the middle finger
just to show you how smart Varejao is:
1. He sets picks when Detroit is playing Zone..
Webber shooting jump shots = bad. Webber playing low post = good. Sheed needs more low post. Yeah I feel pretty good too Rob G. Hehe, more BS calls as I type…..
Well, that just answered the age old question of “How can you foul someone that is falling ontop of you?”
And I think Webber is playing PISSED. In the 1st quarter they showed a clip of him running back on defense after a show going to commercial yelling “I ain’t going home!”.
I am REALLY getting pissed with these shit calls.
More BS calls…
I’m getting pissed, too. Pissed. Ah, god.
I am a teacher. I teach a college class, and our text on Monday is “Michael Jordan and the New Global Capitalism.”
I will lecture about the Bad Boys on Monday. I want to lecture about the New Bad Boys, who held back another #23.
I hope that Monday’s lecture goes well.
Larry Hughes is going to try and pull a Willis Reed in the 2nd half, only he will continue to not make his jump shots and still be wearing the pantyhose on his arm
The Pistons SUCK!!!!!! Go Memphis Grizzlies!!!!
I’ll take a tie at half time. Come on… let’s win this 3rd quarter.
Sorry guys my wife posted that… I love our team… Oh she is from memphis..
Blaay!
I don’t usually blame games on calls, but this whole series has been B.S. They charge to the basket and if we touch them in any way its a foul. If we charge yo the basket we have to get hacked good or its an offensive foul. Lebron can run full blast at the basket and get a foul call no matter what way too often. Gibson gets fouled if you sneeze with 5 feet of him. Maybe its just been the refs that frustrated the pistons the whole time? Good chance.
Put me down for thinking this officiating is pretty bad. I especially loved the sequence where they changed their mind instead of calling a charge on Gibson, they called the block on Dyess. Then the next play was Gibson definitely getting in Tay’s way on that layup and they didn’t call it. It was so egregious that even Steve Kerr was saying “wow, Prince really should be at the foul line. If they’re going to call that block on McDyess, they’ve got to call it on the other end.” Okay, I need to stop now, I’m getting angry.
obviously your wife has never watched the Memphis Grizzlies play… well, it’s hard to watch Memphis unless you have NBA Season Pass… either that, or you tune in to the NBA Draft Lottery every offseason.
You have to KO a champ. The Cavs have to KO us. If not we will win….
Man, everybody got a wife.
Maybe that;s why Krista’s last name is Jahnke. HEr maiden name’s propably “Sexpot.”
Twice as many foul shots as us….
all starters are going to clear 40 minutes by a mile. gotta go out guns blazing. gotta give rob g. some material for his hungover monday morning lecture.
HOLY HELL!!!! CHARGES!!!! FOR US!!!!!
this next comment is NSFW
Daniel Gibson is a piece of shit.
Another shady foul for Gibson. This is getting very annoying.
Why don’t they show a replay of those BS calls? Why? Instead, it’s “Dodge in the City.” Cleveland sucks! You can’t buy a pair of shoes in that city! I know from personal experience!
I don’t want no Dodge commercial! I want footage of referee incompetence!
Never have I hated a Boobie more in my life.
the forearm distributor is in the game… time to throw some ‘bows
damn, super small lineup in now
Push in the back by Sideshow Bob on that rebound…….
31 to 16 free throws?
yup, total lumbar shove.
I want my boys to be all elbows and teeth. Fuck it. Kill ‘em all, let David Stern sort ‘em out.
Boobie will pick up stupid fouls, time to post him up
#1 stupid foul by Gibson: trying to undercut McDyess.
Told you
boobie again….
enough from f-ing mcdyess. shit his useless ass down.
BAH HAHAHAHAHA! Nice shot jackass.
and sit it down as well
right next to lindsey hunter.
Detroit is taking this game.
Why was Flip Murray the one that took the last shot?
JackDutch
It’s hard to put others back in the game when they’ve been on the wrong side of shitty calls all night.
Jack:
I assume you posted that before he made that three, haha. But yes, sit him down because now he’ll take more of them.
because he’s selfish
Does anyone else hate Marv Albert as much as I do?
WOO! TIGERS WIN! LET’S GO 2-2 TONIGHT!
GET HUNTER OUT!!!!!!
alright. here we go. 4th quarter.
Why is Flip and Hunter out at the same time….. Flip Saunders, sorry but your retarded. This is 4th qurter from elimination. Your fucking retarded.
Screw rest…. put them in the goddamn game. Stop these friggin’ kick outs to Gibson.
Yes, switch to the worse possible lineup at the beginning of the last quarter when losing this game means we are out of the series. Please fire Saunders.
jesus. we’re going to be beat by a guy named boobie.
Daniel Gibson is just ridiculous. Why why why???
Do we really need the starters to rest when we are 12 minutes from getting eliminated.
THEY ARE STILL IN THE MOTHERFUCKING GAME!!!!!
I know Lindsey Hunter signed a 2 year deal, but his contract needs to be bought out
wow. great time to put in your starting backcourt flip. down by 9. with the momentum swing full in clevelands way. great work.
and another trey by boobie.
May as well just lose this game to get rid of Saunders. Its worth it.
HOW WAS THAT A PUSH!
There was no push on that foul. Or that one.
With Saunders as a coach plus all these BS calls, theres no way to win.
i can feel it slipping away, guys. these calls are just sickening, and we can’t finish.
if Detroit is going to go down, Rasheed should put a fist in Varejao’s face
why hasn’t maxiell played? why did we see nazr?
aaaaaaand the technical.
aaaaaand the ejection.
aaaaaaand it’s over.
It’s over….. Rasheed almost punched that ref.
Somebody needs to tell Sheed it sometimes ISN’T better to burn out, than fade away. Words can’t describe my distaste for this level of play. This isn’t on Saunders, it is squarely on the people NOT hustling, NOT making shots and NOT playing good defense.
when can we sic dale on sideshow?
I never thought I would say I hate Boobie.
Ok. that was funny Steven Kerr. “boobie trap”
Dale Davis isn’t going out without a fight
Hehe, the announcers are saying the Cavs have such poise….. He can we have poise if we get a foul call no matter what we do? I thought there was supposed to be tougher calls in the conference finals, let alone the playoffs. I hear a whistle every 10 seconds, how is that? There’s more fouls than any regular season game, this retarded. As long as Joe D. fires Saunders after losing I’ll be ok.
To watch the rest of the game or not? I’m waiting for a homicide.
I vow tonight will be a legendary drunk. I will come inches away from a divorce. I will rage deep into the night. I will drink to forget but have this night scarred upon my brain.
I thank DBB for a wonderful season of blogging. Thank you, Matt and Ian. They deserve much love.
So the real question is. After tonight, do you:
1) Root for the Spurs
2) Root for the Cavs
3) I’m not going to watch the finals
We have to blow this team up, don’t we? I don’t see how we can bring the same cast back next year. I really don’t. I’m not saying that I don’t love my team, but seriously. Flip has to go, it’s time to start this over with Rip and Tay as the building blocks.
I choose Spurs no question. But then again… it’ll probably turn out to be like last year. BS calls all the way.
Well, it’s been a good 5 year run. They were a good team for a good period of time…now the long decline has officially begun.
Good bye Chauncey. Thanks for 2004 and 2005.
Atleast the majority of my friends are Philly fans…….
It is Saunders fault for not taking Sheed out when he gets frustrated since we all know that it hasn’t done any good for him this series. He has been bad for us the last few games in the 4th. Put max or carlos in who aren’t frustrated and you would get more energy on both ends from them.
they’ve chosen to die like individuals
bring back the teal uniforms
Wait…. yes. I see something hanging out of all the Cavaliers shorts… Yes, that what I think it is. The refs are hanging on thier nuts.
hate both teams. can’t imagine spurs not winning it in 5. but i didn’t imagine this either, so…..
other matt: I agree - Tay and Rip are the faces (and mask?) of the future. We need a new team built around a long-armed brand of stingy D.
And I need some more beer.
LeBron’s played pretty good defense tonight… only 1 foul
Before Sheed got tossed I was hoping for a “you wanna see a foul, THAT’s a foul!” type moment. It can still happen…
As he was getting tossed I really wanted him to throw his headband at the ref. Why not? Take the fine… these guys make enough. I mean really, what a $10,000 or $20,000 fine to these guys?
I REALLY hate the NBA sometimes.
It’s obvious the priorities in the offseason are get someone that can flop (Spurs and Cavs in the finals, the two biggest flopping teams in the NBA) and someone that can coach at least at an 8th grade girls level.
Atleast we got 2 1st rounders. Who we looking at? Let’s sign Vince Carter, haha.
My season is over after tonight. I won’t watch the finals, but I’m thinking the “All Flop Finals” is an appropriate name. Varajao vs. Ginobeli, who will out-flop the other? Spurs in 6.
Thanks for the great blogging this year. See y’all in November or sometime this summer when Dumars starts doing his thing.
Q Dog
Too late though. It is a lot on the coach. I bet even with all Lebrons BS calls, spurs will still dominate them like we never did. Flip never had any good strategy planned for the Cavs.
I’m almost relieved to lose. I want changes, I’m tired of this we have to be down to care attitude. A stricter coach wouldn’t let the whole team feel that they are not even worried about the Eastern Conference Finals. We need a whole new gameplan.
empty the bench already, saunders. and empty your office while you’re at it.
I’m sorry Antonio. I’m really sorry.
Party’s over, folks. I’d rather go through the growing pains with Max, Amir, Delfino, and Acie Law getting big minutes than preserve the status quo. Sad.
Why couldn’t we get Billy Donovan?
How did Gibson not play much this year? He is better than anyone on the Pistons!
Yeah, but who’s the new coach? Carlisle? Brown? Who’s free right now?
Yeah. The saddest part is Dice and Webb. C’mon. Who wants to lose when they’re on the team?
I’m free.
Acie Law. Please.
I have a feeling I will be eating my own vomit tomorrow.
God. Time to eat some white castle to make the pain go away.
I don’t know if this is an upset. I do know that I am upset.
i’m disappointed, dale. queria o sangre brasileiro…
what’s the over/under on the technical-for-flopping rule next year?
Did you ever think you’d be pining for Rick Carlisle to come back? I mean, seriously? That’s how absolutely pathetic Flip has been in this series. When Mike Brown is outcoaching you, it’s time to find a new profession. Can you imagine how scary Cleveland would be with a competent front office/coaching staff?
I feel bad for McDyess, but not anyone else.
I really liked Webber when he was at Michigan, but I don’t feel bad for him. He kinda glommed(sp?) on with the whole “Karl-Malone-I-gotta-join-a-contender-so-I-can-win-my-ring” thing.
I think Bill Russell could dominate the Cavs’ front line better than Detroit did tonight.
Credit to the Cavs. They play D. And they get calls. Maybe that’s all we had all these years. I don’t even know anymore.
What about Javaris Crittenton?
sangue, puto.
I’m texting with Matt right now (he’s at a wedding, lucky guy). Here’s your preview for tomorrow’s post-mortem: “I want Sheed’s head on a platter.”
He’s not a happy guy.
DJ - It’s a bit rude to correct people’s Spanish. Especially when they hardly know written English.
Time to watch some violent Hannibal Rising.
Time to watch some porn. Detroit got f’ed. Now I want to see some big-tittied blondes get it.
Scot Pollard looks uncomfortable
Oh, don’t get me wrong. Cleveland did an excellent job. Give credit where it’s due. Gibson was huge. Hughes hit some shots early. Gooden wasn’t awful. They definitely won this series. If I were a Bulls fan, I’d be terrified that their “young core” will never get a chance. That’s how much the Cavs scare me.
And I don’t know much about Crittenton. I watched a lot of Acie Law. He seems a little Billups-esque to me. Hits big shots. Plays good D. Is fearless. I like him a lot. Whether or not he lasts ’till 15 is the big question. Unless we work some kind of sign-and-trade out with Billups, where we might be able to acquire another pick or something.
Rob G: just make sure the porno doesn’t have any, wait for it, wait for it, wait for it, BOOBIES.
yo, i was actually correcting myself, and it’s portuguese, amigo. mas ‘ta tudo bem - we’re all entering the alex acker era together!
Personally, I think a good coach for Detroit woulda been Jim O’Brien
saw some yahoo article touting the pistons interest in rodney stuckey at 15. but i’d be ok with crittendon as well.
gotta get a van gundy. 2 van gundys on the market. gotta get one. maybe both.
haha Stan Van Gundy coming back and getting revenge against Miami… I love it
Well since we didn’t even come close to dominating one game this series, I don’t think it was just their defense or the BS calls. Yes, that was part of it, but as soon as we got a up a few points we would get sloppy. We wold only have focus a few minutes at a time, best case.
A problem is they made adjustments better than us the whole series. Thats on the coach. Most problems point to coaching.
so. do we resign chauncey?
I was actually thinking about Stan Van Gundy. I like what he did with the Heat in DWade’s first 2 seasons. I don’t always buy the theory that they would’ve beat us in the 05 East Finals had Wade not been hurt. But damn were they a good challenge. They had no buisness being any good in 04, but I think made the second round.
Van Gundy would be nice. I want the Ron Jeremy version personally. Come back and have him vow revenge.
And I do think that Acie Law would be there. Mock draft site I go has him dropping to Miami (!!) at thier pick. Anyone have any other good draft sites? I use http://www.nbadraft.net.
i really liked jim o’brien in philly. he was the guy who pushed for iguodola in that draft. he just got dicked over by webber. i’d rather have o’brien over webber any day of the week.
I watched until the fourth quarter. Glad I missed the end of it. It’ll be interesting to see how we do next year with Chauncey Billups, Antonio McDyess, and Chris Webber. Really curious as to how we’ll even make the playoffs.
Flip Saunders needs to go and we need a new coach pronto. I say bring back Carlisle or however you spell his damn name. He’s a good coach in need of a job.
I’m upset that the Cavs are now forcing me to root for the Spurs. I hope they beat James down every time he tries a power dunk.
I just don’t even know what to say anymore.
I think all Pistons fans are masochistic. Chalk me up as one of them.
Scratch what I said earlier about Carlisle. Here’s who the real head coach should be: Bill Laimbeer. Let’s bring back defense, shall we?
draftexpress.com is decent. though in their mock they have durant going #1 to portland, so i don’t know how legit their info is.
I’ll take that deli cook at coach. Stan Van G would work. Mustachioed sideline rage, and pretty decent adjustments. At least he would know how to work a time out. I have had faith in Flip like a Catholic has in Mother Mary. But it’s over now, baby, and I’m sinnin’ with an eye to the confessional booth.
I’m with you, Rocky Cliffs. Laimbeer would be awesome.
Man, look at the Cavs roster:
Shannon Brown
Daniel Gibson
Drew Gooden
Larry Hughes
Zydrunas Ilgauskas
LeBron James
Damon Jones
Dwayne Jones
Donyell Marshall
Ira Newble
Aleksandar Pavlovic
Scot Pollard
Eric Snow
Anderson Varejao
David Wesley
I don’t see them striking fear in the heart of any opponents, so why couldn’t the Pistons beat them? Why did Cleveland win FOUR STRAIGHT? What the hell happened?
At least Lamb would teach our boys how to hack properly. We needs to knock the studs down.
Dwayne, spelled the right way? That’s pretty frightening…
Bill Laimbeer would be sweet. At least he won 2 WNBA championships for Detroit. What about Flip “nervous” Saunders, what has won? I don’t even want to watch next season if he’s coach.
All I know is: Dumars better NEVER make a move for Varejao. Not even as a role player. Not even as trade bait. I don’t want that man even associated with our organization. Unless the NBA morphs into the NFA - the National Flopping Association.
Man. We have to wait til November?
yeah. time to hire billy.
Why is noone mentioning terry porter as maybe our new head coach? Joe got to talk with the man all year and he knows what he can do, so I think there’s a good possibility that he’ll be our head coach. Then maybe bring in Laimbeer as our new assistant coach.
Time to watch Delfino, Tayshaun, and Chauncey in the world championships.
I like HoopsHype. They have Law going to Atlanta at 11, which I think is about right. They do have the most horrible GM this side of McHale (or Ainge, an extension for Doc, really?), so we have that going for us. The biggest threats to take Law are the Clips and the Hawks. Both of those front offices are incompetent. If Law is gone, we have to take Crittenton, I think. The last thing we need is another athletic and offensively challenged big man.
I wouldn’t be opposed to Laimbeer as coach.
Ehhh now that I think about it, I don’t think Acie will fall. Bucks need a PG.
Rocky Cliffs dont be a hater. If you guys won I would be rooting for you. You may dislike the fact that the Cavs won, but i am also tired of people who think they know basketball always saying how the Eastern conference is inferior to the West.
How they say if Cleveland was in the West they wouldnt even make the playoffs.
Enuff is enuff!! Regardless how you feel the best team won this series. The Cavs should have won one of the first two games in Detroit.
You guys had your run and you should be very very very proud of what you accomplished the last 5 years. Now it is time to pass the torch you cannot always be on top!
The younger, more athletic and better defensive team won this series. I know it is hard to accept or tip your hat too.
I do not want to be a punk and rub it in on you guys either. I have the most high respect for your organization, your fans, and your players but the time has come to let us take a shot.
Rebuild, get a few younger players, and by all means get a Ben Wallace type player for defense. Webber is not the answer, and sometimes a player that you grew up with and has roots in your town does not mean he will translate into greatness.
Good luck next year it was a pleasure to have you all allow me to post here. It was even a bigger pleasure to not have any of you be disrespectful or call names. You are true fans and you will one day get your just deserts!!
I initially said I wasn’t going to watch the finals, but I think I will just to see the Spurs kick the Cavs ass.
I’ll take Porter as HC. i’ll take another highlight reel of Maxiell dunks, too. Cuz I’m sick of this LeNike shite.
Eric - Dude. I’m going to root for the Cavs. I’m still an Easterner. and Texas is another country to me. It produced Bush, after all.
a few good things though.
at least we won’t have to watching another god damn HouseOfPayneTheCloserHeartlandSavingGrace commercial.
Can you blame a whole state for that?
You know what’s the best part of solving a crime? It’s when the BIGGEST movie star appears as a guest show on this hilarious new comedy/gritty cop show!
Two ill begotten wars? Yeah, I’ll blame a state!
Anyone think the black guy from the closer sounds like Brad Pitt?
Eric, thanks for taking the high road (sort of). I do appreciate you not rubbing it in, becuase I think I speak for everyone when I say that I’m sick to my stomach over this. To only get one title out of this team is so disappointing. I know that sounds ridiculous to a Cleveland fan who hasn’t won diddly. But you’ll get yours (maybe not this year, but eventually) and you know that.
I am proud that this isn’t a blog-a-bull type meltdown, though. It’s getting close, but it’s not there yet.
The last prez my state produced was some clutzy rich boy who could only govern once some bizarre troll left office. Texas has cursed us with two losers.
Okay Rob, let’s reel it in a bit. Let’s not get into politics. We’re all Pistons fans, and that’s what matters right now. This could get ugly if we keep going there.
Don’t get me wrong, I agree with you about Bush, I just still think he’d be a weenie if he was from Maine, or Alaska
Laimbeer as coach would be nice, especially if the Pistons are going young.
But if they are going to repackage the core guys and make another run… I’d call up Larry Brown.
There, I said it.
Right. Right. Pistons. NOt politics. Sorry. Anger. In fact. I wanted to say that I’ve very much enjoyed all of y’alls comments and posts. I recently moved from MI to DC, where there are not many D fans. And I feel as though I have not left home when I read DBB. Thank you all.
Good Lord, Ian. That makes sense to you and to me, but I’m pretty sure we’re still paying him. And I think Rob would sooner vote for Bush than Mr. D bring pound-for-pound back.
Your 2007-2008 pistons lineup:
Chauncey
Rip
Tay
Maxiell
Amir
Law
Acker
Delfino
Mcdyess
Tyrus Thomas
Nazr Mohammad
draft pick (Rudy Fernandez?)
Blalock/Dupree
Sheed and 27th pick in the draft was traded for expiring contract of PJ Brown, Tyrus Thomas and Bulls (new yorks) first round pick. Flip Murray, Cwebb, Davis all left town.
Nazr Mohammad traded for a fruit basket(actual fruit basket, not an insane person) before trade deadline.
Really, Ian? LB? Do you think the players would like that?
Matt Gibson: I need Sheed, though. i need him. I respect him more now than ever.
Rob G: What has given you this more respect. Your drunkingness?
Yes. And the fact that he was the only consistent defensive presence on our team. And the fact that he was the only consistent low post scorer on our team. Plus the fact that he’s a bad mofo. And the fact that I’m getting drunker by the moment.
Max and Amir would probably be our best rebounding and defending duo. And if we’re going to rebuild might as well start giving these guys some major burn
I kind of agree with Rob on the respecting Rasheed thing. The officiating was atrocious, and Sheed at least went out with flying colors. The lack of composure was totally unnecessary, but it’s not like it would’ve mattered.
Rob, all I know is that Sheed didn’t pull this shit on LB’s watch. And the defense would never have allowed Lebron’s free for all on Thursday. In fact, I would argue that with LB, the Pistons might already be practicing for the Spurs right now.
That said, as you guys have pointed out, this has little- to no chance of happening. But…
If Phil can go back to Los Angeles, then anything is possible.
LB is the best coach without a job right now. He’s been humbled, just as the Pistons have in his absence. I think the players would welcome him back — the tough sell would be Joe D and Mr. D.
I’d love Tyrus Thomas but I’d want a bigger guy. Maxiell at the 4 and Johnson at the 5? We’d get pushed around.
Amir Johnson is Tyrus Thomas, without the PT. Give Amir a chance, and your thirst for energy plays above the rim will be quenched.
Johnson is almost 7 feet. 6′11 and a half apparently. And I don’t know. I just want to see Amir play atleast 20 minutes a game. He has incredible potential and I dont want to see him waste it on another year in the dleague.
Michael, Ian, et al - We need a center. A true center. Like Z or Shaq. Screw small ball. Who is our new center? It’s not Amir or Webb or Sheed. Who is it?
Oh I know he is tall. But he weighs, what, 220?
LET’S GET DARKO BACK!
I don’t think Joe D would be a tough sell. I think LB could come back if he was willing to accept peanuts for a salary. I don’t see that happening. You’re point about Rasheed not pulling shit on LBs watch it spot on, though.
And since somebody else mentioned Darko, I can now go here: Anybody want to do the 03 draft over again and take Bosh? I’m assuming that’s a big ‘ol yes from the contingent.
the meltdown continues. and Nike marches on. We are supposed to be the antidote to the individual, the ying to the marketer’s yang. But i guess the team gets ground up in the machinery that drives the dollars and cents of the NBA.
I am wasted.
The Chosen One
by David Stern
darnit. I’m gone for 2 minutes and some already posted we should get darko back. I was going to say it. That would be an interesting story. Especially if he does get better
Agree and disagree on the “small ball” comment. I’d love to have a true center, but the league is slanting towards the more mobile centers, rather than bangers.
At this point in his career, methinks Amir is a tall 3, much like KG was.
While it is slanting towards small ball, no one has won with it. I don’t know who is out there though or in the draft.
You guys, I didn’t like the officiating in this series either, but Detroit didn’t deserve to win.
In fact, as I worried about in the preview post above, Detroit didn’t even leave with “dignity intact.” Cleveland was better when it counted… in the playoffs.
This is true but atleast it gives us something to complain out. We collapsed in the 4th for many reasons. I’d like to blame Flip for letting them open up on us 6-0 with friggin’ Flip and Lindsey. I mean come on.
Michael — no one has won with it yet, but it’s coming. All I know is that we need more mobility from the position than C-Webb could provide.
LeBron does not even have a clearcut number two. Assuming he gets one, the East is toast for a decade.
Just swap pieces in and out like the Bulls did for MJ and Pippen.
Yep. Agree with Ian. We didn’t deserve it. We didn’t earn it. We barely made it to the ECF. Pretty sad. I guess it’s a good lesson in organizational sociology: how do people put themselves in a situation where they really ought to do well, but then they fail through lack of interest?
why, Chauncey? Why?
No doubt about that one, Michael. That Flip/Lindsey backcourt made me sick to my stomach.
I know this’ll never happen but what if we somehow traded for KG? Sheed and something else for KG.
Easy, the Pistons acted like they were entitled.
LeBron acted like he wanted it.
Dude - the Sheed-for-KG rumor has been raging for at least four los ninos. No way. We’re not getting KG. and even if we did, what would we do with him?
Maybe not four los ninos, but two, anyway…
I didn’t get the sense that the Pistons acted entitled this year; they were definitely more wary than years past. I think that perception comes from them trying their hardest to look unflappable even in tough situations.
They weren’t cocky; they just weren’t as good. Couple that with the fact that NO ONE outside of their circle of fans wanted to see them win — partially because of Lebron, partially because of past cockiness, and partially because everyone has seen Spurs/Pistons before — and you have fans thinking the Pistons acted “cocky”, “entitled”, “whiny”, etc. So be it.
If we got Kg, we should host fights between him and Dice.
I’m going to borrow a phrase from the Worldcrossing Detroit Tigers forum.
B.U.T.T.
Blow Up This Team
Screw the Pistons. I’m a Hornets fan now…
…
…
Ok. Just kidding.
There’s no doubt this team has to be blown up. I love Chauncey, I really do. But 6 more years of him at $13-14 mil per isn’t the answer. We’ve got to go young and start over. We’ve got some nice pieces. I’d like to see a sign-and-trade with Chauncey to help us get some picks or additional pieces.
Oh, and I don’t believe we have the salaries to match up with KG, unless Billups AND Sheed go there.
In a lot of ways, a Pistons team featuring a rotation including Acie Law, Amir, Max, Delfino, and Alex Acker would be more fun to watch than this year’s team.
Could be the disappointment, could be the beer… but I think the current squad has run its course.
Billups & ‘Sheed
for
KG & something
A 1st rounder would be ideal but that’d be too much.
I agree a million percent with you, Ian. It’s a chore to follow this team anymore. It was so fun in 2003 and 2004 when we were the plucky underdog. But it’s just not fun at this point. If this team goes on together for the next 2, 3, 4 years, I won’t have any hair or it’ll all be gray. And I’m not even 22.
It’s not worth it to keep re-eating the vomit.
I think I’m hitting the sack here. Thanks guys for a great year. If ANYONE wants to shoot the shit, hit me up on AIM at Detroit Mike 13 or http://www.myspace.com/wingboy2999. I need to talk to more people from Detroit. All I know are Philly and Pittsburgh fans.
Even George Blaha wasn’t himself today. From the start of the game he seemed disinterested, and I can only remember a few times where he actually called a play enthusiastically. Did anyone else notice this too? Maybe he was tired from the double overtime game?
Guys want something to take your mind off things?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FPc28FASaEE
Sidenote: how is it that someone can get caught biting prostitutes… and then be back in the saddle as if nothing had happened?
[Fadel, as you can tell, I had to listen to Marv tonight.]
had to watch the postgame, just to get a sense of things. didn’t feel right. it felt awful.
i think they got to re-sign billups, despite his AWFUL ecf. we have to develop the kids. HAVE to. but i think the overall experience for our rooks and 2nd years in these playoffs was tough. not a good thing for amir to have a front row seat for sheed’s meltdown and not good for blalock to get an actual jersey in the face from a teammate. obviously maxiell showed why we love him so much, but that was about it. flip’s gotta go. just gotta. and i don’t care if the whole staff follows him out the door. i think cowens has been great for maxiell, but that’s about it. porter is just another doc rivers or mo cheeks waiting to happen. harper’s just a guy to show off rings. gotta go van gundy. gotta make the deal before the draft. this has to happen. flip saunders is not the coach for the detroit pistons. i can’t type that last sentence enough.
and i feel happy for the city of cleveland, not so much for the team, because i don’t like many of the guys on that roster, but clevland fans deserve some sports-related happiness from time to time.
except not the browns. not ever.
You needed Ben Wallace. He wouldnt let LeBron get to the basket the way he did. In fact I remember a number of times last year when Wallace blocked the crap out of balls going to the glass. Not to mention his ability to even up the major rebounding edge the Cavs had over the Pistons.
You cannot put a price tag on a tall defensive minded stopper. I think that is what the Pistons really missed the boat on the most.
Rob G., I’m in Northern VA, and a D fan. Don’t feel like you’re alone
Eric, pardon me while I don’t cheer for either team in the Finals. I don’t enjoy basketball enough to stay up late (and be tired as balls at work the next day) to watch the NBA Finals between 2 teams that I don’t want to watch.
Detroit doesn’t need Ben Wallace down low anymore. It’s time for this team to create a new identity for itself. This off-season and next off-season are important to the overall team’s success for the immediate future. This off-season the Pistons have a chance to get rid of a little bit of salary, and then next off-season Detroit has a big expiring contract (Sheed) that they can dump in a deal for something young.
If Detroit makes a run next year, great. It’s time for this team to re-build around Tayshaun Prince, Carlos Delfino, Jason Maxiell and Amir. I believe a sign & trade involving Billups would make a huge statement that all of this “attitude” is unacceptable.
Well, at least the Tigers beat the Indians tonight. I didn’t get why Mohammed, Delfino and Hunter were in for so long in the 2nd. Why was Mohammed in the game at all? We could have been up at the half. All in all, despite a poor second half in Game 6, I’m pretty proud of the Pistons’ 5-year ECR run and at this point, can’t contemplate what coaching or lineup change makes sense. It’s a lot easier to criticize from the comfort of my laptop than to be in Dumars’ shoes.
Chauncey Billups needs to go. He was outplayed by freakin Daniel Gibson the entire series.
Sheed goin out like a gangsta was the best highlight of this season.
And I agree with alot of you that this team was alot more fun to watch during the rising up years then their current status.
Also, we need to get Bill Laimbeer as our head coach… someone who demands respect. None of the players have any respect for Flip and rightfully so I guess.
Time to look forward to the draft..
Did anyone see the FSN post game coverage??? Apperantly there was a HEATED exchange between Mitch Albom and Tayshaun Prince!! Someone please tell me they got this on youtube?!?! I cant believe I missed it!!!
At 1st I thought Maxiell must have been injured. Then I remembered that Flip Saunders is still your coach.
Wow. We were all witnesses.
*Not b/c of fouls or non-fouls, not b/c of flopping, not b/c of a conspiracy, but b/c one team that was hungrier than the other went out and took care business, not just for one game, but for four in a row.
*Lebron and the Cavs are for real, wether we like it or not, and they aren’t going anywhere for a long time.
*For now, a city and organization that has never been to the Finals will get to enjoy the ride Piston fan has been on before.
*6 knock-down drag-out games, I’ll take it, great series to watch.
(too bad ’sheed went bizerk, plenty of time left with the game still in reach)
*Keep in mind, the Cavs did beat the Spurs both times they played in the regular season. Should be an interesting Finals.
Boney I think your dead wrong ala I dont enjoy basketball enough comment. Wallace wasn’t the offensive side of the ball you needed. You have the scorers; Sheed, Rip, Prince, and Billips. At the half if I told you LeBron on only took two shots would you not think Detroit would be winning? (tied 48-48) But look at the rebounding edge 24-16.
With the games as close as they have been throughout this series Wallace would have at least very least added a +5 to that total.
Just like in football, defense wins championships and you guys understood that with having Wallace. Now you are physically mismatched against a larger team.
I definitely wouldn’t mind Larry Brown as coach either. In his 2 years here, we won The Finals the first year and were one game from winning the finals the second year.
Yes, but we know that Larry Brown is out for himself. I don’t know how we could trust him again.
What happened to this team? Did they implode? When the playoffs started they looked like they could beat anyone, then all of sudden game 4 of the semi’s they lose it. It’s really been since that point that this team hasn’t looked quite right. It may be true that there have been some “in the locker room” action that we don’t know about. Regardless of that what is the status for this team next year? Having skimmed through your guy’s previous comments I found the anger rising up again for this team. I guess all the comments about this team being old and on it’s last legs are more true now. The youth movement will hopefully be in full gear next year. I don’t think Chauncey will be back next year (incidentally doesn’t Chicago need a decent PG?), Flip is probably NOT going to be back (either murray or saunders), and who knows maybe even Bill Davidson sells the team. Okay maybe that’s going TOO far.
Words can not express how I felt last night. When Daniel Gibson hit that 3 with alittle over 10 mintues left I knew it was over. So instead of putting my fist through my TV I turned it off. Yeah that’s right I turned it off. Does that make me a bad fan? Maybe…but it makes me a good father..lol…if I had kept watching it I probably would have had the entire house awake including my 3 yr. old.
Amir and Madmax are the future for this team. Correct me if I am wrong but I don’t think Amir is allowed to go back to the D league next year. His eligibility for the d league is over. And according to Piston.com he is 6′9″. But he is still young and could be growing for all I know.
Laimbeer would be a excellent coach for this team. If nothing more than to get these guys….uh oh here is a phrse we haven’t heard in a long time……to play the RIGHT way. They definitely did NOT play the right way for most of these playoffs. It would be hard for me to watch LB on the sidelines again. The man knew what he was doing…and true he could be extremely humbled by everything that has happened but could we trust him?? I am just going to throw this out there….and I know it probably makes NO sense…but what about Joe D?? He had been around these guys…he knows them better than anybody else. I know you don’t take one of the best execs in the league and throw him into that position….it was just a thought.
So what will this team be like next year? It won’t be too long before we find out alittle bit of the direction. Only 25 more days untit the draft.
Eric…Ben wallace is a shadow of his former self…he may do a few things here and there…but I don’t think he would have as much of an effect on the game like he once did. So assuming he would be the difference is ludacris. What this team needs is a general. I thought that was Chauncey. I guess he forgot.
What’s worse NOT making the playoffs or making it to the eastern conference finals and then messing the bed?
I say we have to resign Billups, only because there’s no one available to replace him. That said, with the guys available out there, and the (I think) need to blow up this team, this is what I propose:
Trade: Rasheed Wallace, Rip Hamilton, and the #27 for Kevin Garnett and the #6.
-This rids us of the Sheed problem, and while I love him, I think it’s time for him to go. Rip is good, but only in a system that is built around him. Plus, KG is hungry, and we need those hungry players back.
Trade: Billups, Mohammed, Amir Johnson, and the #15 for Kobe Bryant.
-Sign and trade Chauncey, I hate to see him go, but I think he’s satisfied with what he’s accomplished. You could tell, he was talking about everything the team’s done the last few years instead of talking about how much they’ve come up short. LA won’t take the trade without getting some young pieces, which we have to give up with the pick and Amir, and while I don’t like letting amir go, we’re getting a 28 year old Kobe to fight LeBron next year.
Draft: Mike Conley Jr with #6
-This gives us our replacement PG for Chauncey to run the team for the next 15 years. He and Blalock will be competant in a year or two, and will do a good enough job in the mean time.
Fire and Hire: Saunders and Tom Izzo
-This completes the change from the old team to the new. If Joe D can convince Izzo to coach the Pistons, everyone would have new motivation to win a chip.
This gives us a lineup of:
PG: Conley, Blalock, Hunter
SG: Kobe, Acker, Murray
SF: Prince, Delfino
PF: McDyess, Maxiell
C: Garnett, Samb
I’d take it
I hate to say this but we just got out played! This is what we need to do.
1. Keep the Coach! There is no one out there who can do a better job. Stop and don’t start bring LB back talk. Its not going to happen. Mr. Davis is not going to let that happen. For the most part Flip has done a good job. I think this will again make him a better coach. Just like last year made him a little better this year. Plus Mr. Davis does not what to pay another coach to leave.
2. We have to get younger when it comes to our front line. I still love Sheed ( Yeah he made me mad but you got to love his passion) But his role need to change for this team. Forget about a trade! Its not going to happen. He may need to be a reserve player now or play last mins.
3. Don’t resign C-Webber. He is old and does not have much remaining. He could not even stay with Z!!!!! Wow.
4. Our rotation of 8 have to get better. Carlos and Mad Max had good year but I don’t know if they are the answer to take us over the top. We need some guys to come and change the game or light a fire when needed! Like Vinnie Johnson.
5. We have to get a better back up PG who can play SG as well.
6. Resign Mr. Big Shot but not for the max! He still is better than most PGs but we still need to get a better back up for him who can change the pace of the game and score.
7. I like the idea of getting big Zach but what would we have to give up to get him. I am sure they don’t what Sheed back and I don’t want to part with Tay or Rip to get him.Plus I don’t think we can make the money work anyway. We still have to sign a free agent this summer to make another run at a ship. I like Jamison from Washington but he does not fix with Tay in the line up. Maybe O’Neal??
If you told me that Daniel Gibson would make 7 shots and it would translate to 31 points I wouldve spared myself of watching the game.
The only point of the entire 2nd half where I was happy was when Sheed did what I was dying for someone to do. There was no way Detroit was going to be allowed to win the game. He knew it, you knew it, they all knew it.
I just wish sheed would have physically attacked the ref. I was hoping for that. Alas maybe next year
fixed! Thats all I have to say about that. 50 FT’s for the Cav’s? The only reason it was even close in fouls was the reff’s trying to make it look legit in garbage time. Flip Saunders is a complete and utter moron. We have the lead 4th quarter and he has Murray and Lindsey on the floor and gave away the game! Even with the David Stern fix we still could have won this game if not for Flip Saunders. He belongs with the Gophers a big family of LOSERS! FIXED!
I share the anger here.
If LeBron is wearing a 2007 Finals championship ring in July, we can all stop watching basketball until David Stern is dead. He practices a bad marketing strategy that’s outdated by at least 10 years . . . it’s about teams, not players.
The professional sports rookies that are entering leagues today . . . arguably more irresponsible across the board, but a case could be made that there is far less tolerance in the “casual audience” for a professional with an arrest and jail record.
Goodell and the NFL get around this with a winning strategy . . . it’s not about Peyton Manning, it’s about the Colts. It’s not about LaDainian Tomlinson, it’s about the Chargers. It’s not about Tom Brady, it’s about the Patriots. This way, the league can weather the storm of a talented young star, every so often, that really lacks proper personal discipline. The NFL avoids the Michael Vick and Pac Man Jones travesties by focus on the entire team. It’s that simple.
And to add to the idea of marketing teams . . . it’s MUCH MUCH EASIER to weather the greatest storm of all . . . the day a legendary player hangs up his career.
Green Bay Packers will still be able to sell tickets to the games when Favre retires. There’s no loss of cabin pressure and any interest whatsoever when Jerry Rice called it quits. When Barry Sanders retired, there was shock, but there was still plenty of interest in the Lions, despite no real reason for there to be any available from Detroit fans.
Such will be the case when Manning, Tomlinson, Urlacher, Brady, and the current stars hang up their game.
Clearly the sentiment around here is to “sort of” rebuild around key pieces of this team. While I feel the same way, let’s just say that getting rid of either Billups or Hamilton AND Sheed would do this team a lot of good in the short term.
I believe if the Pistons picked up Zach Randolph, they’d have another Charles Rogers on their hands like the Lions had. The last thing you need for a guy with the attitude and history of Randolph is to have him around his boys.
I believe it’s time to get rid of Richard Hamilton while his value is at it’s highest. He cannot create his own shot, and is one of the only shooting guards in the league that I do not want to see shoot a 3 pointer because he isn’t consistent from deep. You risk getting older by trying to get Ray Allen and his big contract, but the Pistons need a Ray Allen type if they’re not going to want to go after a ball handler and shot creator. Noone respects Hamilton’s long range shot, and that should be one of the things teams should fear from a shooting guard that can’t create his own shot.
Eric,
Ben Wallace would have made no difference in this series. Plain and simple dude.
I don’t enjoy watching the Cavs nor do I really enjoy watching the Spurs all that much. It’s not about whether I’m a Pistons’ fan or not, neither of those teams are worth it for me to stay up late for a game that starts at 9pm on the east coast and be late for work the next morning.
Whoever said trade Rip, Sheed and #27 for KG and #6 is crazy. Minnesota is not in a position to win now, whether it’s with or without Sheed. They’re not built to be a grind it out team. I can tell you went by the rosters when you were offering up those trades ideas because Cheik Samb is at LEAST a year away, if not 2 before coming to the NBA, if he even makes it at all. Plus, McDyess will break down if he is a starter. IT would be nice if Detroit got Kobe, but it’s not necessary.
If it could be worked out, I wouldn’t mind seeing a Rip for Lamar Odom deal if Kobe gets traded. If that happened, then you could probably swing a deal with ‘Dyess or Sheed to get a SG to take Rip’s place.
But, I’m not in the business of making trades. I’m just saying that Rip needs to go.
I don’t know the ins and outs of trading either, but there is no way in hell we can get KG and Kobe and I don’t even want them. I agree with Boney in that Rip needs to go. I’m reluctant to say we still need Billups, but we sure as hell can’t live with Flip Murray and Blalock’s not where we need him yet.
And whoever said we need to trade Amir is crazy. Him and Max is where our future lies.
How come people keep proposing all these trades like Sheed for KG? Sheed for Kobe? If I was a GM, I wouldn’t trade Vladamir Radmanovic for Sheed. Sheed has little value these days, especially after getting thrown out of such a crucial game.
In defense of Chieck Samb, I believe it was an article on this site that quoted the Pistons front office as saying that he was playing well, averaging a double-double, over in Europe against competition comparable to the D-League. To me that sounds like he’s ready for being on the team and learning from the vets, much like Maxiell and Amir did this year.
And don’t underestimate who Joe can or cannot swing trades for. No one thought that he could get Rasheed and Mike James for Hunter, Rebraca, and Bobby Sura either.
And I’m really not sure what ‘going by the rosters’ means, but I put the players on there who I’d like to see back, meaning that Webber, Dupree, Dale Davis could all be let go or traded away. Samb and Acker aren’t on the pistons’ website roster, so that statement just confuses me.
My confidence in this team stemmed from the idea that Flip Saunders would have learned from his previous mistakes in Minnesota and Detroit’s run from last year.
When I believed in the Pistons, I believed that Flip could adjust his system with five solid players to defeat any club of any comparable quality. You can’t find 5 guys who are worthy of 30 minutes in a starting role, these last two years, on any other club in the league.
My confidence eroded over the course of one series when everything Flip put into his game plans and adjustments turned out to be so inflexible against what really was a solid perimeter defense and trapping system. Any team in the league could have beat Detroit with that game plan on a minority of nights, but Flip’s system was so rigid that in the end, any playoff entry in this year’s series would have defeated them in seven games.
The players aren’t completely at fault.
I felt the same about Dallas when they dropped like a stone against Don Nelson’s game plan. Dallas’s roster is much better than Golden State’s. If the Spurs had faced Dallas instead of Utah, then San Antonio would have had some trouble.
The second season, the playoffs, is about matchups and adjustments. For two years, I’ve watched a man walking the sidelines who has been given more than most other coaches in the league have to work with . . . and I have watched that man fail.
All of the talk about trades for superstars . . . that’s born out of irrationality and frustration with the outcome.
Don’t tell me that Golden State was the better team. And don’t tell me the Cavaliers are the better team, either.
For over five years, for most of this decade, in wake of the Lakers, I’ve watched San Antonio and Detroit fly in the face of David Stern’s league of stars and high scores.
The Pistons aren’t wrong . . . the league is.
The system can be beaten.
Sauce I wanna shake your hand after that post.
Matt & Ian, you guys need to stop blogging bankers hours.
@Sauce - Nice post. I don’t think that Saunders is inflexible. I just don’t think he coaches a proven playoff offense or defense. The idea of doubling and tripling LeBron was so stupid, because not only are you daring his teammates to score (open shots) but you are playing into the strengths of Cleveland which are mid and long range jumpshots.
I would have rather he gambled on Lebron scoring 50 points each night instead. That seems like something he wouldn’t have been able to do in 4 games out of 7.
Larry showed us that if you remove the role players, the stars will tire and eventually miss shots. It’s winning basketball to remove multiple options, not one option.
The offense is a finesse scheme that looks great during the season when the games are meaningless in the grand scheme. Teams are on back to backs, you play all of the lotto teams and with some skilled players (which we have) you can easily coax out 90+ PPG.
How totally retarded was it that we started playing post up basketball in the ECF? That’s not who we are, even if it is a system that could work.
The man is a chameleon. He says one thing and does another. He claims one thing and his players say it is not true. We had guys play bad, but it is hard to argue that they were put in a position to win. And he is absolutely, terribly horrible during the game. No feel for when to call timeouts, when to challenge the refs, and a complete inability to make adjustment calls on the fly. Couple those failures with his un-inspirational demeanor and it’s a wonder we didn’t lose to Chicago.
Thanks, Micro and Robbie.
TheMicrowave: You added some solid points about Flip’s problems. I did see it as inflexible, but your observations help. I’m not sure if posting up was the ultimate solution or not, but I did see a complete unfamiliarity from guys like Rasheed when, during Larry’s days, Rasheed spent way more time in the blocks than he currently does.
The following is a set of statistics compiled by 82games.com for Rasheed Wallace’s shots. The percentage I’m trying to point out is the “inside” percentage.
http://82games.com/03DET11A.HTM (Rasheed 03-04 Detroit reg season) 23 percent inside
http://www.82games.com/04DET13A.HTM (Rasheed 04-05 Detroit reg season) 27 percent inside
http://www.82games.com/0506/05DET13A.HTM (Rasheed 05-06 Detroit reg season) 16 percent inside
http://www.82games.com/0607/06DET13A.HTM (Rasheed 06-07 Detroit reg season) 19 percent inside
Especially in 2006, a large spike in Rasheed’s 3-ball attempts happened . . . also, what’s significant is the dwindling number of shots which were dunks and tip-ins.
It seems like Rasheed spends way too much time out on the perimeter.
I am not sure if the dunks and tip-ins decline is due to his play usage changing under Flip, or if he’s just not capable of ramming it home and hounding for rebounds like he was back in 04-05.
With this inside game . . . every time Webber, Wallace, or McDyess got the inside pass . . . they seemed to take forever to make a decision whether to post-up the guy, turn around to face the defender, made a fadeaway jumper, or pass out of the situation. By time, it seemed like they were taking seconds instead of knowing what to do with the ball the moment they received it. By the time they did get that decision made, Zydrunas or Gooden or Varejao or Marshall and company would come on over to double-up on defense.
It reminded me a lot of what was happening with the two Wallaces in the 04 Finals, when Shaq would get it in the paint. He also spent too much time making a decision with the ball, as well.
With Rasheed, though, he’s been a power foward in this league for almost 1,000 games. He’s been through Larry Brown’s inside-out system to remember what to do inside . . . so what was it? Was it Rasheed’s declining athletic ability, or was it that Detroit’s Flip Finesse Jumpers and Cuts system was run so much for so long that when it came back to getting dirty in the paint - Rasheed hadn’t had enough reps to readily remember?
Micro: You’re right about the banker’s hours.
Everyone: I tried to put together a post earlier today but still didn’t know what to say — and I didn’t want to bump this thread down since it contained some of the most intelligent analysis I’ve seen about the future of this team. In other words, you guys f-ing rock. I’m just the emcee, you guys are the show.
Here’s a good link for NBA draft information -
This recent link includes a NBA like combine -for potential
high draft picks -
interesting reading -
Here’s a good link for NBA draft information -
This recent link includes a NBA like combine -for potential
high draft picks -
interesting reading -
http://nbadraft.net/duffy001.asp