For your information, here’s a little contract research (limited mostly to SGs or pseudo SGs, with a couple non swingmen sprinkled in for perspective) proving the deal is modest. Please, do tell me if you’re upset with Rip’s 7 year/$62 million deal (approx. $9 mil./year with escalating pay, ends in 2010, but he can opt out this summer) in light of these deals:

Ray Allen: 5 years - $80 million (ends in 2010)
Joe Johnson: 5 years - $70 million (ends in 2010)
Michael Redd: 6 years - $90 million (ends in 2011)
Vince Carter: 5 years - $78 million (ends in 2012, with that year being a team option)
Wally Szczerbiak: 6 years - $65 million (ends in 2009)
Shawn Marion: 6 years - $79 million (ends in 2008)
Peja Stojakovic: 5 years - $64 million (ends in 2011)
Rashard Lewis: 6 years - $118 million (ends in 2013)
Samuel Dalembert: 6 years - $58 million (ends in 2011)

I think that shows it’s easy to overpay and overvalue. I’m going to be okay with Rip making about $9 million a year for the next two seasons (just about a $1 million per less than Kevin Martin) if he so chooses, especially considering he’s so much better than you give him credit for (in any system where he can get OPEN), and better than a lot of the players listed above and below. At this point in his career, Ray Allen really doesn’t offer more than Rip, but he makes $18 million dollars more in two less years of work. It’s easy to overvalue and overpay in this league. The Pistons don’t, especially with Rip.

Just to give you some sense that I’m not blindly arguing one view, here are some reasonable contracts belonging to some good to great guards:

Kevin Martin: 5 years - $50 million (ends in 2013)
Raja Bell: 5 years - $24 million (ends in 2010)
Leandro Barbosa: 5 years - $33 million (ends in 2012)
Manu Ginobili: 6 years - $52 million (ends in 2010)
Caron Butler: 5 years - $46 million (ends in 2011)

There are a lot more contracts like the first set than ones like this set in the NBA. Boney, be happy we have Rip and have him at the rate we do, and please, stop hating already.

All contract info provided by a wonderful site:

http://www.eskimo.com/~pbender/contracts

He’s earning his check, by no means is he a max player no matter what he says when he opts out of his deal (I think after next season).

I think we can all agree that Rip is better than Willie Green, and we waxed his own-shot-creating behind. It’s not the key to everything to have a swingman who creates his own shot. Our formula works for us. If it’s not broke, I’m not going to fix it. Hell, as mortal as they look right now, don’t forget that regular season dominating Boston has the original jump shot-only SG in Ray Allen. We’re just fine, and part of the reason we are, is because we have Rip busting his ass every night and earning every cent of his modest (by NBA All-Star standards) paycheck.

Hamilton is a product of the system LB, plain and simple. Sure, he improved his 3 point shooting ability (he still isn’t a real threat behind the line aside from his % because he doesn’t take that many), but he never has improved his shaky ball handling ability that in my opinion has kept him from becoming a top 10 player in the league.

He needs Detroit more than Detroit needs him. Others on the team could go to other teams and basically provide almost a carbon copy of what they do for Detroit, except Rip. If/when Rip is not running off screens set by others, he is not effective (Game 1 76ers). His defense is average, at best. His mouth has by far put him in front of Rasheed for irresponsible technical fouls called.

“we have regularly dispatched teams that have guards that can create their own shot”, OH RLY? 05 Spurs, 06 Heat, 07 Cavs, scraped by the Lakers this year once and got smoked another, etc. Stuckey is the future of this team, and it’s not going to take Billups’ entire 5 year contract for Stuckey to finally get some PT. We run the risk of losing the talent we have by keeping the old guard around a year or 3 too long.

I’m eating crow because I said he sucks during the 6ers series, only to have him shoot lights out in the final game and be a reason we won. I still don’t like the guy, I don’t think he’s the best this team can do. When we were 4 on 5 on the offensive end, we were at our best. Now, sure it’s “team ball” but this whole “anyone can kill you” goes out the door when no other team in the league has as balanced a starting 5 as Detroit’s.

“Anyone can kill you” while Rip is shooting 4 of 17 or when Billups has 8 turnovers trying to make passes that just aren’t there…

Fox thought it was huge for the Pistons. “You can stop a scorer but you can’t stop a shooter.”

How about Rip finishing fourth in three-pointing shooting percentage this season since dedicating himself to improving it in the off-season (That’s fact, check DBB archives highlighting it, video of Rip talking about it should exist)? That work ethic (and production) isn’t good enough? Okay, fine. Boney rips him for being “Larry Hughes like” regarding his shooting percentage (a career 45.5% shooter is not the same as a 41% shooter), but last I checked, Rip has never averaged below 44% shooting as a Piston (system or not, effective is effective) and shot 48.5% this season, good enough to make him Top 10 or 15 among guards (depending on who you consider a guard). Can we consider that while Chauncey’s free throw shooting has been spotty (82.2% for Chauncey is quite bad) during the playoffs, Rip is hitting 91.3%. Since it’s a what have you done for me lately league, I remind you that it’s the same story last season (Rip - 86.5% Chauncey - 83.2%).

Long story short, Boney’s not eating crow, because he still tries to maintain that he has good reason to hate Rip (because early in his career while playing with him, he emulated the best ever? Really, that’s your criteria? Lame). He offers no apology. He tries to tear Rip a new one for not creating his own shot, when the Pistons have routinely dispatched plenty of teams in the past few years with SGs who do create their own shot. He tries to argue that McDyess and Sheed are too busy looking for the ball to set picks like Ben could (absurd, team ball is team ball). His argument is paper thin, and MP is right in saying that given the reasonable contract and considerable talent Rip carries the only legitimate upgrades that a case could even be made for are Ellis and Martin (with a large part of the case based on age as opposed to sheer ability). Get off it, Boney.

Otherwise, there is pretty much no one in the league that a) we can afford and b) could end up an improvement over Rip.

@Laughton: I would absolutely not want Arenas on our team. If I knew he was going to be healthy throughout his contract, there’d be no question. But his knees are too much of a gamble, and I don’t even think Kander could magic them back to health.

@joejoejoe: Trading our starting backcourt is pretty much insane. We can’t ship out our team’s identity and expect a star and a scrub to will us back to contention. Besides, whether Rip is flawed or not, the tandem of Billups and Hamilton is the top starting backcourt in the entire league.

Whether or not Hamilton stays, which at this point is only blog-based conjecture, I want Billups and Rasheed to retire in Detroit. Hopefully Prince too.

Should we trade Rip, we may not aim to bring in a top SG in his place. We might want to aim for a) a true center (Biedrins) or b) someone solid to backup Tayshaun. Although I wouldn’t mind signing Herrmann for a few more years, but I’ve already made my case for that.

They got him… and it was like 2 months before the trade happened.

I’ve said it before, I’d trade him for a guard off the bench and a 1st round pick or two. His value is enough to return a 1st rounder or two.

I’m not against trading Rip. He is the most hotheaded of the Pistons, often taking too much on himself. But it’s hard to find a better player at the price, largely BECAUSE he doesn’t drive for fancy dunks or shoot a million 3s. His limits keep him from being another overpriced SG. So if we trade him, we’ll probably take on a new set of limitations. If that fits within the team’s framework, fine.

but when he’s on, he very quietly (and usually quite easily) scores 20pts and gets 5 assists a game.

chauncey wouldn’t have half the assists or assist to turnver ratio he has if it weren’t for rip hamilton. (i’ve always felt that I could get at least 4 assists per game, just passing to rip on the curl)

Rip has his problems, but to me he’s just as flawed as anyone else on the team, and unlike others, his problems are usually easily corrected. If Chauncey is off, he’s off and you can’t do much about it. Same with Tay. Once Sheed’s head is gone, it’s really hard to get it back. But when Rip plays stupid like that it should be easy for a coach to pull him, repeat the words “Run, Catch, Shoot” over and over again and he should be fixed. God, if only so little maintenance could help Chuancey or Tay when they’re playing poorly.

Chauncey + Rip to Phoenix for Steve Nash + Raja Bell
Chauncey + Rip to Houston for T-Mac + Chuck Hayes

…but then I got over my bitterness and said Go Pistons!