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DBB Debates: Logos, first rebuttals

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The people have spoken, and Team Teal won the right to choose to go first on the rebuttals or allow New Logo team to go first. New Logo has the floor, and throws some pretty serious shade. 

So, in a surprise to some and a done deal to others, Team Teal won opening statements. They (Jamie) decided to give the floor to the New Logo team (Mike) for rebuttals. I’m going to leave the opening statements here for clarity’s sake, so scroll down for the first rebuttal (such a good word). Jamie’s will follow.

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NEW LOGO: Mike Snyder

This isn’t a debate, it’s a massacre. Potentially, I could continually run out the shot clock on each possession and still be the unanimous victor. Sports debates, basketball or otherwise, get into trouble when one of the sides is assigned to defend the indefensible and their heart clearly isn’t into it; yelling just to yell is on its last legs of entertainment options. In this case, however, Jamie Delaney actually believes he’s in the right – which blows my mind. So not only am I going to run up the score but I’m not pulling my starters until they all have at least 20 points. At that point, I’m checking Boban Marjanovic into the game and telling him that Jamie thinks he’s overpaid and a bad dancer.

From 1996-2001, the Detroit Pistons sported a teal jersey with a pissed off horse and a couple of obligatory exhaust pipes because, you know, we’re the Motor City and all. Basically, it’s the organization's version of a mullet. When high school graduates from the late 80s to early 90s reminisce over the glory days flipping through their yearbook, reality smacks them in the face as the hairdos (that they chose presumably without a gun to their head) are the first thing everyone notices and in turn, mocks relentlessly.

Why would the Pistons do this to themselves? Why would they make a conscious decision to be a mullet?

If I had to guess, I assume the Pistons were trying to capitalize on the merchandising success of the early 90s Charlotte Hornets which was an undeniable hit. Unfortunately for Detroit, lighting didn’t strike twice and the pissed off horse with the obligatory exhaust pipes became an undeniable disaster. Wanna know how I know why? Because that era only lasted five years (four years and 364 days too long) before the organization came crawling back in the right direction.

In defense, the Pistons weren’t the only team in the league to succumb to cartoonish and rather outlandish logos. By now, though, most teams wised up and rid themselves of the goofy, ballooned branding.

That was in defense of the Pistons. Assuming he’s of sound mind and body, what legs does Jamie have to stand on?

The new Pistons’ logo and the traditional one isn’t the best in the world but it’s a helluva lot better than that stupid horse mostly because it doesn’t break any tried and true branding rules.

By and large, successful logos - that actually last - are simple and comprised of two or three (tops!) primary and/or secondary colors. Think of some of the emblems throughout the sporting world that have stood the test of time: Chicago Bulls, Los Angeles (Vegas) Raiders, New York Yankees, I mean, the Dallas Cowboys is a plain Jane star and it’s awesome. Again, we should aim in that direction, a clean look becomes a classic look. Often times, simplicity is the ultimate form of sophistication. That Pistons’ horse belongs with Bugs Bunny and the rest of the Looney Tunes and not representing your favorite basketball team.

Here’s a question for you: What’s an easy way to support your team?

Here is an answer: Buy a hat.

The hat game is much like the logo game, keep it easy.

Hats are like referees, they should be seen and not heard. Is there anything louder than a teal hat? Like referees, if people are talking about your hat, you’re doing it wrong. Teal hats scream “I’m trying hard to stick out.” Grow up Peter Pan, Count Chacula, it’s not Halloween. With that awful teal logo, how can I support my team without looking like I’m getting ready for a middle school dance or Fred Durst?

So who you with?

A mature, refined adult like myself? Or would you rather keep rollin’, rollin’, rollin’ with Fred Durst, Bugs Bunny, and Jamie?

So, in a surprise to some and a done deal to others, Team Teal won opening statements. They (Jamie) decided to give the floor to the New Logo team (Mike) for rebuttals. I’m going to leave the opening statements here for clarity’s sake, so scroll down for the first rebuttal (such a good word). Jamie’s will follow.

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TEAM TEAL: Jamie Delaney

Judge DBB, my colleagues on the right side, my colleagues on the other side (*cough* trash ass side *cough cough*), to the Gores family, the Van Gundy family, the almighty based God, the NBA family--ladies, gentlemen, trolls, and lurkers good morning to you all. . . .

Let me start by taking you back to the year 1996. Clinton was in the White House. Jordan was back in the league. Pogs were super hype. The internet was this thing that messed up your house phone and porn was a scrambled black and white channel in the 100s - because, and brace yourself here, that’s the max amount of channels we had. NBA Twitter was you yelling at friends over Sports Illustrated for Kids in the cafeteria. These were simple times, and unfortunately simple is exactly how the Pistons felt.

In 1995-96, the Pistons won 46 games. Grant Hill had established himself as an All Star guard, and that’s about it. But only six years removed from a championship, and in the midst of Hockeytown renaissance, the Pistons were playing with house money. A first round playoff sweep at the hands of Shaq and Penny’s Magic? To be expected.

But as the 96-97 season loomed, the Davidson family knew a change was needed. Perhaps a new coach? A splashy free agent signing? A blockbuster trade?

NAY….

OR DID I MEAN…

....NEIGGGHHH

If you look up magnificence in the dictionary, this logo is pictured. I have seen a Caribbean sunrise, a pacific sunset, many wonders of the world, and the birth of my first born son.

But nothing has moved me to tears the way a flaming horse in a teal circle did and still does to this day.

They say to never peak too early, but what if I told you the peak was in fucking space. Because that’s how high design this, and also coincidentally how high you would have to be to think this is a trash logo.

The tremendous teal era began during the 1996-97 season, and it was glorious. The team went on to win 54 games. Grant Hill averaged over 20 points a game, and instead of a first round sweep, it was a competitive five game series that we eventually lost to the Atlanta Hawks.

Regardless of the outcome, this logo was an important mark for a franchise. It was a shedding of the skin, a necessary change, and a new dawn of Pistons basketball.

This was the 90s, and instead of the Pistons holding onto their patriotic red white and blue 80s vibes, we made our jerseys look like they had sex with a can of Surge.

Because that's what you did in the 90s.

Grant Hill. Kenny Smith. Joe Dumars. Jerry Stackhouse. Theo Ratliff, Allan Houston, Mateen Cleaves, Corliss Williamson, Ben Wallace, Lindsey Hunter, Christian Laettner, Lou Roe. LEGENDS of the hardwood that are now part of a brotherhood that bleed maroon alternates.

Critics will say that the colorway was an abomination. That it was and to this day remains a blemish on the franchise history. That these teams accomplished nothing of worth only furthering the disgrace of the teal horse logo.

Today, I regret to inform you that these individuals hate animals.

That’s right PETA, open up that Google Alerts.

Because you know what the Pistons don’t have without the teal era? What historical figure of our franchise was missing?

This guy.

(Sh*t that’s a bad picture)

Who would eventually become this guy:

(Much better)

Because without the teal, we’d probably have a god damn engine block running around the court, shooting oversized t-shirts in our beers. And who the hell wants that. I’ll tell you who

NOBODY.

My opponent will praise the new logo, the nostalgia of a championship era, the timeless simplicity. Instead, I will call to mind this quote from legendary advertiser and designer George Lois.

"Advertising is poison gas. It should bring tears to your eyes, unhinge your nervous system and knock you out.” - George Lois.

I am a proud lifelong Pistons fan, and I can safely say we accomplished Mr. Lois goal with the birth of the teal horse. I know this because we’re still talking about these jerseys to this day. Because four out of five results on Google for “Pistons throwback” are the glorious teal. No other NBA team took such a creative risk, nor has one done so since, and this is the mark of a majestic logo.

And to be honest, no matter what, it will always be better than this.

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NEW LOGO: Mike Snyder - FIRST REBUTTAL:

Wow, I totally misjudged our DBB audience. That’s 100% on me and I apologize to the new logo for letting you down. I do have a couple quick questions for Team Teal:

Are you excited about getting your driver’s license in a couple years? Just think, you won’t have to sneak into R-rated movies and you’ll be eligible to buy tobacco products and lottery tickets in the not-so-distant future. Just remember, though, high school is going to fly by and before you know it, you’ll be filling out college applications. Good luck!

Based on the embarrassing logo poll results, the DBB faithful is clearly full of pre-pubescent tweens that get turned on by flashy colors and cartoons. It’s the only way I can explain the disappointing outcome.

Or maybe I didn’t take into account color blindness which is a real issue that affects thousands of people nation-wide, I mean, have you actually seen the teal logo?

Or maybe, just maybe Team Teal hasn’t reached NBA adulthood which unfortunately is a disease mostly found in message boards and on Twitter. It’s a real thing but thankfully it’s not contagious and is treatable.

How do you know if you’re not an NBA Adult? Here are some symptoms for diagnostic purposes:

You’re more concerned with points scored than wins earned.

You believe Kobe Bryant had a better career than Tim Duncan.

You encourage a Ricky Davis triple-double.

You’re counter argument includes “Well, it worked in NBA2K”.

You have a hard time accepting change. Example – Anything Charles Barkley has ever said in regards to

basketball.

You have on-going NBA discussions about who would win one-on- one.

You wear elbow sleeves to play pick up.

You get hysterical over free tee shirts at NBA games.

You subscribe to the theory that Andre Drummond should just lock himself in a gym and shoot free-throws.

You start any sentence with “If I was seven-foot tall, I’d…..”

The list goes on and on but most importantly to our conversation: you publicly cling to philosophies that in your heart, you know are wrong. THE TEAL ERA WAS UGLY AND YOU KNOW IT. Some people just like to see the world burn and are forever contrarians.

When I read Team Teal’s opening statement, all I could envision was a used car salesman.

Boy, have I got a deal for you! He’s setting you up to buy a lemon.

Be an NBA Adult and do the right thing.

_________________

Jamie and Team Teal up next...turn it up, bring the noise Jamie

TEAM TEAL: Jamie Delaney

Before we bust open this Stone Cold Steve Austin, grade-A American can of overpriced farm-to-table whoop ass, I first want to take a moment to thank you, the good people of the internet for voting with your hearts and your smarts.

The teal logo was considered by many on the DBB staff to be an underdog going into the debate, but you all knew better. You knew and continue to know something that my dear friend Michael seems to have sorely missed out on. That this logo is more than just a teal and maroon majesty of horsepower and heroics.

That this logo for lack of a better word is just simply fun.

It’s not conventional, it’s not traditional, but neither is a Doritos Locos taco and we all know how good that shit is.

What’s worse, Michael didn’t even defend the traditional logo. He instead used his rebuttal as an attempt to put us, the good NBA and horse loving eccentrics, on blast. Calling us children and “pre-pubescent tweens” and insulting our NBA intelligence. He claimed we’re not “NBA Adults.” So instead of personally calling him and his logo out and slandering him for casually dropping a 2005 Wedding Crashers joke in his original argument, I will go through these misdiagnosed symptoms one by one and help our friend Michael realize his wrongs.

You’re more concerned with points scored than wins earned.

Considering the Pistons were 26th in points scored, yes we are. Because being 28th in 3PFG% with a 1-in-4 out offensive system is pretty concerning and having a direct relation on your coveted wins earned. Also seems like you too were concerned about points scored at one point.

You believe Kobe Bryant had a better career than Tim Duncan.

Of course we do, because he did. Before you pull up a spreadsheet with all the MVPs, rings, and NBA accomplishments, I’m going to ask that you zoom out and look at the post-Jordan NBA landscape holistically. Kobe was an NBA personality tour-de-force that provided 3 major developments.

1) Provided the blueprint for high school to pro NBA prospects.

2) Shifted and opened up the competitive landscape for NBA apparel by going with Adidas - a move that kept the league buzzing with awareness.

3) was able to maintain the NBA’s globalization that Jordan and the dream team started in the 90’s. Shit he’s been retired for a year and still is one of the top selling jerseys in China.

I like to look at this way, imagine if the NBA existed without Kobe and then imagine if it existed without Duncan, one looks drastically different without the other, and I’d argue not for the better. Reality is that this is a personality driven league. The NBA needed Kobe which is why any lacking personal/statistical achievements are made up for what he did from a cultural standpoint.

You encourage a Ricky Davis triple-double.

Yes, because if you think Waiters Island is good, I’d imagine Ricky’s Reservation would be just as entertaining.

Your counter argument includes “Well, it worked in NBA2K”.

We can’t help it that this is our only productive outlet for basketball genius.

You have a hard time accepting change. Example – Anything Charles Barkley has ever said in regards to basketball.

“The new Pistons’ logo and the traditional one isn’t the best in the world but it’s a helluva lot better than that stupid horse…” - Charles Bark- er, actually, that was you

You have on-going NBA discussions about who would win one-on- one.

Considering that one-on-one is an ideal end result for many offensive systems, and still what the end of games comes down to, I think it’s a fair argument point.

You wear elbow sleeves to play pick up.

Look I can’t help that Iverson was a god while I was growing up.

You get hysterical over free tee shirts at NBA games.

Now you’re just making this personal. Keep tees for threes out your mouth.

You subscribe to the theory that Andre Drummond should just lock himself in a gym and shoot free-throws.

Yes, and we keep that gym locked and trade that gym to another team for a better defensive big man.

And lastly Michael, If I was seven feet tall I’d throw on my teal jersey and kick it with an eye-level Boban while I ask you to hold this L.

Poll

Round two, who do you got?

This poll is closed

  • 52%
    Team New Logo
    (86 votes)
  • 47%
    Team Teal Logo
    (78 votes)
164 votes total Vote Now